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Lupin1
KF Sempai
KF Sempai

Joined: 15 Dec 2009
Posts: 1049
Location: NH USA
Styles: Isshinryu, Judo

PostPosted: Sun Nov 28, 2010 5:57 pm    Post subject: Breathing During Kata Reply with quote

Ok. I'm still a beginner (5th kyu) and so I know there's a right way to breathe while doing kata, I'm just not sure what it is. My instrutor tells us that breathing is something we don't usually start focusing on until black belt and for right now we should just practice the moves. Which *was* fine with me-- until I moved to 7,500 ft.

I'm going back home for Christmas and will go to classes at my old school for a few weeks while I'm there and so I'm starting to get really serious about practicing because I'm really determined to go back better than I was when I left. I don't want any backsliding. So I've noticed that the "whatever" style of breathing that was fine for me at sea level doesn't quite cut it up here. By the 2nd or third time I run through a kata I'm huffing and puffing and need to rest. Yes, I'm a bit out of shape, but I'm also very sure it has a lot to do with the altitude as I'm not this bad at sea level.

So I've been trying a breathing technique where I pretty much purse my lips and breathe out quickly on every technique in the kata (like short "blowing out a candle" breath). It's improving the strength of my techniques and forcing me to breathe after every technique, but I'm not sure it's right. It's there a correct way of doing this?
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evergrey
Brown Belt
Brown Belt

Joined: 21 Jun 2010
Posts: 734

Styles: kyokushin

PostPosted: Sun Nov 28, 2010 7:05 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

In through the nose, out through the mouth, and hwen you breathe out, project from your gut, not your throat! As you throw a strike, breathe out so that it finishes on the full extension of your strike. Breathe in as you back and prepare to extend the next strike.

At least, that's what I'm told. I don't tend to breathe much at all in the middle of a kata, which isn't going to go so well for me long term, haha!
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BDPulver
Green Belt
Green Belt

Joined: 12 Apr 2008
Posts: 386
Location: Kentucky and New Jersey
Styles: Isshinryu, Kobudo, Knife Training

PostPosted: Sun Nov 28, 2010 7:18 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Its actually a bit complicated without showing you in person. there's different breathing techniques for every aspect of Karate. but all are the same it depends on what what is doing.

Meditation is when you concenttrate on the technique of the breathe. In through your nose done to your stomach area and slow exale through your mouth.

Kata's are a little different. Depending on the kata depends on how you should breath. Take kusanku and sanchin. Two unique katas but different ways of breathing due to the moves.

We always worked on breathing drills for as long as I can remember and this was before I became shodan.

But one great way to help with breathing is running or bike riding. Try to concentrate on breathing through your nose and out your mouth even when you need to breath heavy try to steady it so its always the same.
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sensei8
KF Sempai
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Joined: 23 Feb 2008
Posts: 8260
Location: Owasso, OK and Van Nuys, CA
Styles: Shindokan Saitou-ryu [Shuri-te/Okinawa-te based]

PostPosted: Mon Nov 29, 2010 10:02 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

BDPulver wrote:
Its actually a bit complicated without showing you in person. there's different breathing techniques for every aspect of Karate. but all are the same it depends on what what is doing.

Meditation is when you concenttrate on the technique of the breathe. In through your nose done to your stomach area and slow exale through your mouth.

Kata's are a little different. Depending on the kata depends on how you should breath. Take kusanku and sanchin. Two unique katas but different ways of breathing due to the moves.

We always worked on breathing drills for as long as I can remember and this was before I became shodan.

But one great way to help with breathing is running or bike riding. Try to concentrate on breathing through your nose and out your mouth even when you need to breath heavy try to steady it so its always the same.

Very solid post!!

One of the things I'd add is that the breathing, in Shindokan, must be coordinated with all foot movements, and one must remember to relax following the breathe, and in that, not remaining tensed, and that is so one can transition into the next movement(s). However, that goes in concert with what BDPulver said...

"...there's different breathing techniques for every aspect of Karate. but all are the same it depends on what what is doing."

Learn how to properly breath ASAP!!



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brickshooter
Green Belt
Green Belt

Joined: 04 Sep 2010
Posts: 421


PostPosted: Mon Nov 29, 2010 10:50 am    Post subject: Re: Breathing During Kata Reply with quote

Lupin1 wrote:
Ok. I'm still a beginner (5th kyu) and so I know there's a right way to breathe while doing kata, I'm just not sure what it is. My instrutor tells us that breathing is something we don't usually start focusing on until black belt and for right now we should just practice the moves. Which *was* fine with me-- until I moved to 7,500 ft.

I'm going back home for Christmas and will go to classes at my old school for a few weeks while I'm there and so I'm starting to get really serious about practicing because I'm really determined to go back better than I was when I left. I don't want any backsliding. So I've noticed that the "whatever" style of breathing that was fine for me at sea level doesn't quite cut it up here. By the 2nd or third time I run through a kata I'm huffing and puffing and need to rest. Yes, I'm a bit out of shape, but I'm also very sure it has a lot to do with the altitude as I'm not this bad at sea level.

So I've been trying a breathing technique where I pretty much purse my lips and breathe out quickly on every technique in the kata (like short "blowing out a candle" breath). It's improving the strength of my techniques and forcing me to breathe after every technique, but I'm not sure it's right. It's there a correct way of doing this?



I've a feeling that you're holding your breath during kata and not noticing. It's a natural tendency to do this when exerting maximum physical efforts.

So like everyone else said, make sure you breath out strong upon executing a technique. Then relax and inhale.

One excercise you could do on your own is to "grunt" on every technique. If you hear yourself grunting, you're breathing. Can't do this in the dojo of course because it's extremely rude. But it should work well in the privacy of your own home.

BTW, start practicing breathing with your mouth almost closed during kata. It's a bad habbit to open your mouth wide to breath as in doing ordinary sports. The reason is that you would be practicing leaving your chin exposed to a counter attack.
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sensei8
KF Sempai
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Joined: 23 Feb 2008
Posts: 8260
Location: Owasso, OK and Van Nuys, CA
Styles: Shindokan Saitou-ryu [Shuri-te/Okinawa-te based]

PostPosted: Mon Nov 29, 2010 10:58 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

It's so easy to tell when a student or anybody for that fact has been holding their breath during Kata...when finished with said kata....they're breathing becomes deep/labored! Hard to disguise that when the body needs air. I tend to mark low when I see this because proper breathing is so important.


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bushido_man96
KF Sensei
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Joined: 31 Mar 2006
Posts: 24683
Location: Hays, KS
Styles: Taekwondo, Combat Hapkido, Aikido, GRACIE

PostPosted: Mon Nov 29, 2010 12:17 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I always felt like I breathed well during forms, but afterwards, I am tired, and tend to breath heavier and more quickly. I recover, and then go to the next form.
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todome
Orange Belt
Orange Belt

Joined: 22 Apr 2009
Posts: 159
Location: Winnipeg
Styles: Shotokan

PostPosted: Mon Nov 29, 2010 1:35 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Try to make a six-pack. Do it holding your breath and you'll feel the pressure build up. That's exactly what you don't want. Do it letting the abs push air out of your lungs and you'll find its not only faster but allows for a stronger finish.

That's only part of the story.

Although its fundamental to the art, breathing really is an advanced topic because the role it plays doesn't really make sense until a lot of other things fall into place. Stance, for example, because the role breathing plays in connecting a solid stance to the torso creating a total body technique can't really be felt until you've got a glimmer of a proper stance in the first place and that takes years to develop.

Kime in particular is effected by breathing. There's a tendency of students to get puffy with their breathing because that pressure I mentioned at the top makes it feel like they're stronger but since doing so introduces isometric contraction precisely where it isn't needed it's actually reducing power almost exponentially.

Breath out with the gut and try to keep the resulting flow of air unrestricted. It should feel like your rib cage is getting in on the act as well but don't concentrate on that as much since using the abs will bring the intercostals into play naturally.

There's a saying that receiving a black belt just means you're finally ready to start learning karate. It's true, and breathing is one aspect of that. For now, don't sweat the details and, of course, don't hold your breath.
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Soheir
Orange Belt
Orange Belt

Joined: 20 Feb 2010
Posts: 176

Styles: Kyokushin karate

PostPosted: Mon Nov 29, 2010 1:59 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Maybe you should find some video from youtube, where is performed the kata you're practicing and take an example of the one that seems right.
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sojobo
Green Belt
Green Belt

Joined: 26 Jul 2010
Posts: 462
Location: United Kingdom
Styles: Wado-ryu Karate-do, Nihon Koryu Budo, Iaido, Kenjutsu, Traditional Jujutsu, Aiki-Jujutsu

PostPosted: Mon Nov 29, 2010 2:45 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

As with most things in Japanese/Okinawan Budo, there is more to breathing than meets the eye (or simple asphyxiation for that matter).

In both karate, jujutsu and kenjutsu etc., the importance of correct breathing or "Kokyu" is key, but how it is trained varies from school to school.

Some styles have breathing kata, whereas others incorporate it into their training as a natural byproduct of the kata/techniques timing.

In my group, we train a paired kata with the principles of Ma-ai (distance), Kiai (focus) and Kokyu (breathing) but in this case, it implies correct timing to optimize technique.

Sojobo
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