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TraditionalDan
Orange Belt
Joined: 15 May 2007
Posts: 155
Location: Sussex England
Styles: Shotokan Karate-do, Judo.
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 Posted: Thu Nov 01, 2007 8:37 am Post subject: |
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I knew that the European armour was tough, but I was also taught at school (I'm British) that it was very heavy and not easy to move quick in.
One thing I would be interested to know is how long 'European' warriors trained to fight.
I personally don't think it would have been as much as the Samurai, and not as in depth.
We can look at and research the details, but we'll probably never know.
Unless we can recreate a modern Samurai and medieval European warrior, but even then would it be accurate.
More importantly, does it matter?
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Kajukenbopr
Pre-Black Belt
Joined: 18 Jun 2005
Posts: 922
Styles: Kajukenbo - Emperado Method
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| Posted: Thu Nov 01, 2007 10:40 am Post subject: |
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| TraditionalDan wrote: |
I knew that the European armour was tough, but I was also taught at school (I'm British) that it was very heavy and not easy to move quick in.
One thing I would be interested to know is how long 'European' warriors trained to fight.
I personally don't think it would have been as much as the Samurai, and not as in depth.
We can look at and research the details, but we'll probably never know.
Unless we can recreate a modern Samurai and medieval European warrior, but even then would it be accurate.
More importantly, does it matter? |
read the first 5-6 pages of the thread. apparently the weapons were not as hard to manage as we might think.
AND, they did have good training for fighting!
look it up, we had a great discussion back then!
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<<Kajukenbopr>> Be humble, train hard, fight dirty |
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bushido_man96
KF Sensei
Joined: 31 Mar 2006
Posts: 12833
Location: Hays, KS
Styles: Taekwondo,Hapkido, SCA Combat, and I research Medieval Combat
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| Posted: Fri Nov 02, 2007 12:55 am Post subject: |
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| Kajukenbopr wrote: |
| TraditionalDan wrote: |
I knew that the European armour was tough, but I was also taught at school (I'm British) that it was very heavy and not easy to move quick in.
One thing I would be interested to know is how long 'European' warriors trained to fight.
I personally don't think it would have been as much as the Samurai, and not as in depth.
We can look at and research the details, but we'll probably never know.
Unless we can recreate a modern Samurai and medieval European warrior, but even then would it be accurate.
More importantly, does it matter? |
read the first 5-6 pages of the thread. apparently the weapons were not as hard to manage as we might think.
AND, they did have good training for fighting!
look it up, we had a great discussion back then! |
Yes, these are accurate points. It is true that fighting in the plate armor was a little bit more limiting than fighting without armor on, but it was not as heavy or tiring as one would think. What made the armor so good is that not only did it offer great protection, the articulation also allowed for good mobility. The perception that an armored European Knight was slow and clunky, and would get his armored limbs chopped off by a quick Samurai is fictitous. Remember that the Europeans had a long history of war as well; look at the Vikings. They loved it. There were also many Medieval Masters-at-Arms that made their career training troops. I think that many times it is blown out of proportion as to the amount of time the Samurai spent training. Of course, depending on the soldiers' rank, that would also determine what other tasks they performed, and how much time they could spend training.
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Success is where preparation meets opportunity.
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bushido_man96
KF Sensei
Joined: 31 Mar 2006
Posts: 12833
Location: Hays, KS
Styles: Taekwondo,Hapkido, SCA Combat, and I research Medieval Combat
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| Posted: Fri Nov 02, 2007 12:56 am Post subject: |
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| NightOwl wrote: |
Barbarians or not, they knew how to make some fine BBQ....and if that is not a hallmark of civilization then I don't know what is.  |
Amen!
There are two things that I like to look at when assessing a culture's contributions to civilization: the first is food. Fighting is second. (That's right, I put food first!!!!)  
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Kajukenbopr
Pre-Black Belt
Joined: 18 Jun 2005
Posts: 922
Styles: Kajukenbo - Emperado Method
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| Posted: Fri Nov 02, 2007 8:18 am Post subject: |
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| bushido_man96 wrote: |
| Kajukenbopr wrote: |
| TraditionalDan wrote: |
I knew that the European armour was tough, but I was also taught at school (I'm British) that it was very heavy and not easy to move quick in.
One thing I would be interested to know is how long 'European' warriors trained to fight.
I personally don't think it would have been as much as the Samurai, and not as in depth.
We can look at and research the details, but we'll probably never know.
Unless we can recreate a modern Samurai and medieval European warrior, but even then would it be accurate.
More importantly, does it matter? |
read the first 5-6 pages of the thread. apparently the weapons were not as hard to manage as we might think.
AND, they did have good training for fighting!
look it up, we had a great discussion back then! |
Yes, these are accurate points. It is true that fighting in the plate armor was a little bit more limiting than fighting without armor on, but it was not as heavy or tiring as one would think. What made the armor so good is that not only did it offer great protection, the articulation also allowed for good mobility. The perception that an armored European Knight was slow and clunky, and would get his armored limbs chopped off by a quick Samurai is fictitous. Remember that the Europeans had a long history of war as well; look at the Vikings. They loved it. There were also many Medieval Masters-at-Arms that made their career training troops. I think that many times it is blown out of proportion as to the amount of time the Samurai spent training. Of course, depending on the soldiers' rank, that would also determine what other tasks they performed, and how much time they could spend training. |
Japanese culture does put a lot of emphasis on doing things perfectly well. I dont doubt for a second Samurais practiced religiously every day, even if it was different areas of their training.
But yeah, i get your point, the difference shouldnt be THAT much
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<<Kajukenbopr>> Be humble, train hard, fight dirty |
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dete
Orange Belt
Joined: 07 Oct 2007
Posts: 138
Location: gotham city
Styles: full contact Karate and grappling
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| Posted: Fri Nov 02, 2007 9:30 pm Post subject: |
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what I am impressed by the Samurai is that they mainly carried only the sword.
That doesn't sound significant,
but most other cultures carried a sword & shield.
This means the Samurai sword was used to attack & defend.
that is some high skill.
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bushido_man96
KF Sensei
Joined: 31 Mar 2006
Posts: 12833
Location: Hays, KS
Styles: Taekwondo,Hapkido, SCA Combat, and I research Medieval Combat
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| Posted: Sat Nov 03, 2007 3:36 am Post subject: |
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| dete wrote: |
what I am impressed by the Samurai is that they mainly carried only the sword.
That doesn't sound significant,
but most other cultures carried a sword & shield.
This means the Samurai sword was used to attack & defend.
that is some high skill.
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The European Knight had much training in the single sword as well. There is a plethora of work available on the European Long Sword. You are right, however, that the shield was a valuable defensive (and offensive) tool as well.
The Samurai also spent much time with the spear, and at a time the spear was considered the more popular and dominant weapon.
Gosh, it is good to see this thread reserected! 
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on the post.
