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scottnshelly
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Joined: 10 Sep 2004
Posts: 715
Location: Ardmore, Oklahoma
Styles: My Style

PostPosted: Mon Nov 07, 2005 9:32 pm    Post subject: Sore knees or serious problem? Reply with quote

When I was a kid, I competed a lot. I went to a Karate or Tae Kwon Do tournament nearly every weekend. I also participated in bicycle rides and races. After several years of this Ė and a few accidental low kicks Ė I started experiencing severe pain in my knees. I went to the doctor; he said that although itís not impossible for a 14 year old to have arthritis, he didnít think that was the case with me. Upon further inspection he concluded that I didnít have adequate fluid in my knees. He injected me with something (Cortaid, calzone, cortezol, collagen, Caligula, or something like thatÖ). At first my knees were stiff, but then they felt better. I also went to several physical therapy sessions which seemed to help.

After a while, I seemed better and slowed down on the competing. Now itís years later and Iíve started to work out really hard again. I was doing fine until this week. My knees are starting to hurt again.

Is there anything I can do to avoid having to go through all of the doctor bills and physical therapy again? Does this sound serious, or just like sore knees from working out?
Thanks,
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Meguro
Green Belt
Green Belt

Joined: 01 Mar 2005
Posts: 441


PostPosted: Tue Nov 08, 2005 3:52 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Guy:" Hey Doc, it hurts when I do this."
Dr.: "Don't do that anymore."

You were prpbably injected with cortisone, which reduces the swelling in the affected area. The problem is the underlying cause for the swelling is untreated-perhaps it was a strain, tear, poor mechanics whatever. Cortizone treats only the symptom. Some other approach is necessary to treat the cause of the pain or injury.

I think you have to examine what types of activity you're subjecting your knee to. Are you snapping, twisting, running on pavement? When I visited a Dr. for knee pain associated with running, he suggested I build up the muscle around my knee by doing various squat-type exercises. Worked like a charm. The pain hasn't returned in years, 'course I don't run nearly as much either.
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Jay
Black Belt
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Joined: 20 May 2005
Posts: 1190


PostPosted: Tue Nov 08, 2005 11:08 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

if you can bear the pain then dont worry bout it its probably because your growing i get it as well and really i just dont think about it if it hurts so what i can bear the pain so i dont worry
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jarrettmeyer
Orange Belt
Orange Belt

Joined: 11 Oct 2004
Posts: 238
Location: Indianapolis, IN, USA
Styles: Shorei Goju Ryu (6th Kyu)

PostPosted: Tue Nov 08, 2005 1:42 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

If the cartilage in your knees does not produce adequate fluid, then you will need injections. Your knees require fluid, just like the moving parts in your car. An injection of cortisone does not create the fluid or stop the leak, it simply reduces the nearby swelling. Although the fluid will continue to drain from your knee, you will not feel it. You will continue to overstress your knee and cause future problems.

It is a quick fix, not a long-term solution. I recommend that you go to a Dr. who can help you find a long-term solution.
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shogeri
Brown Belt
Brown Belt

Joined: 16 Jun 2005
Posts: 663

Styles: Instructor in Internal, External, Mixed Styles

PostPosted: Tue Nov 08, 2005 2:22 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Aye, the rub of Conventional Medicine becomes more and more apparent.

Out of greed and arrogance, it has operated without it's older sister, Traditional Medicine for much too long now.

Allopathy [other disease] refers to the system of treating disease by inducing a pathologic reaction that is antagonistic to the disease being treated.

That is they work backward from the symptom to arrive at the disease. Then treat the disease.

On the other hand:

Naturopathy [same disease] refers to the practice of not using drugs, major surgery or cutting edge medical technology to treat disease.

Naturopaths rely on alternative treatment approaches that emphasize the natural restorative powers of plants, animals, and the patients themselves.

This includes the management of such things as diet and supplements, homeopathic and herbal remedies, acupuncture, homeopathy, stress reducing techniques, counseling and massage.

Naturopaths are trained to treat and support the whole patient, which includes lifestyle and environmental factors that influence general well-being.

Both Naturopaths and Allopaths can diagnose illnesses from the same sources.

Naturopathic medicine should be used with, not in place of Allopathic Medicine.

The medical philosophy of naturopathy can be found in Tradtional Chinese Medicine.

-------------------------

I would say now might be the time to find out if your body is capable of healing itself using the natural approach as well.

That is, the next step is to find a naturopathic doctor, since it seems that Conventional Methods may not working as you need them to.

-----------------------

The sad part is that harm may have been done to your growth plates at the time.

This means that your knees may not have matured properly into adulthood. This is not a temporary condition. When the growth plates are messed up, and do not have the opportunity to go through their natural function, it has a lasting effect on the usage of the joints in question.

This is just theory, as I am not a doctor, just a fellow Martial Artist, who started as a kid, and has children in sports, and otherwise.



Hopes and prayers go out to you, and I hope you find an answer that works for you.
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scottnshelly
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Joined: 10 Sep 2004
Posts: 715
Location: Ardmore, Oklahoma
Styles: My Style

PostPosted: Tue Nov 08, 2005 6:13 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thanks to everyone for the input.

Meguro: back then it was a lot of snapping kicks to no target, bicycling, running and several other activities. These days Iím doing a lot of running on treadmills and pavement and stationary bikes. Maybe I just need to exercise my knees a little more?

Jarrettmeyer: I hope that this isnít a permanent problem. Perhaps I should get a doctor to investigate. Thanks.

Shogeri: That all sounds great, but where would I find one of these healers in Oklahoma? Iíve never heard of anything like that. Is this common or would I have to travel to India to find something like this?

Thanks again to everyone. Any other advice is welcome as well.
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Meguro
Green Belt
Green Belt

Joined: 01 Mar 2005
Posts: 441


PostPosted: Tue Nov 08, 2005 11:28 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I hate snap-kicking air. Ugh. Won't do it.

The problem I had with my knee was soreness just beneath the knee cap. I found that using a strap (Cho-pat) just under the knee cap eliminated the discomfort when running. Also, as I said lots of squats. These days instead of running I use a Concept ll rowing machine, which gives you a really intense work out and is easy on your joints. An added benefit is that it works your abs, lats, upper and lower back, bi-triceps, quads and hams. What's not to like.
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Aodhan
Black Belt
Black Belt

Joined: 29 Apr 2005
Posts: 1508

Styles: ATA TKD, WTF, Shotokan

PostPosted: Wed Nov 09, 2005 12:02 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

scottnshelly wrote:
Thanks to everyone for the input.

Meguro: back then it was a lot of snapping kicks to no target, bicycling, running and several other activities. These days Iím doing a lot of running on treadmills and pavement and stationary bikes. Maybe I just need to exercise my knees a little more?


How often do you change your shoes? Especially if you tend toward the heavier side of things, the padding in running shoes breaks down at a pretty fast rate. I used to change mine every few hundred miles when I was in cross country (50+ miles a week, changed shoes about every 6 or so). Also, go to a reputable running store and have them evaluate your gait, you may be pronating or supinating which places more stress on your knees. There are shoes designed for that type of gait.

I've also heard a lot of people that have had good success with chondroitin, you might discuss that with your doc as well.

Aodhan
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Toby
Yellow Belt
Yellow Belt

Joined: 30 Nov 2005
Posts: 68
Location: Ceduna, South Australia, Australia
Styles: Jeet Kune Do, Karate, Muay Thai.

PostPosted: Thu Dec 08, 2005 4:18 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Meguro wrote:
I hate snap-kicking air. Ugh. Won't do it.

The problem I had with my knee was soreness just beneath the knee cap. I found that using a strap (Cho-pat) just under the knee cap eliminated the discomfort when running. Also, as I said lots of squats. These days instead of running I use a Concept ll rowing machine, which gives you a really intense work out and is easy on your joints. An added benefit is that it works your abs, lats, upper and lower back, bi-triceps, quads and hams. What's not to like.


I have a rowing machine also, how long would you spend on it a day? Just curious.

By the way, I agree with you... I tend to get sore knees also. But the rowing machine is easy on the body.
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cleung
Orange Belt
Orange Belt

Joined: 31 Oct 2004
Posts: 194
Location: Montreal, Canada
Styles: Kung Fu, Wushu, Free Style Karate, Tae Kwon Do, Kickboxing

PostPosted: Thu Dec 08, 2005 4:04 pm    Post subject: knees Reply with quote

I am no stranger to knee problems as I've had two ACL surgeries. YOu can expect some soreness after a good workout but it they continue to be sore for say 48 hours or more, then you may have overdid it. Scale down your workouts a bit and see what happens. If after doing so and your knees still hurt for 48 hours or more, then you may indeed have something going on in there. If in doubt, always check it out with a doctor. You don't want to do anything that will aggravate a present medical condition - which will ultimately make your medical bills even higher in the long run.
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