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TJS
Black Belt
Joined: 27 Jan 2003
Posts: 1843
Styles: boxing, Thai boxing, BJJ,
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 Posted: Tue Apr 01, 2003 4:17 pm Post subject: |
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| Also, what is the point of wearing shin and instep pads? |
the same reason you wear gloves, headgear, mouthpiece etc..to allow realistic training without injury.
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| Speaking of not practicing for a real situation... do you normally wear a cup around town? If not again, why train for a situation different than the real one. |
I understand the point you are making but I dont think it quite applies for this, You can get your shins used to kicking..you can condition your knuckles for punching, you can to taking a hit, but Honetly i dont think you can get used to getting kicked in the groin..it's going to hurt no matter what..but you can get used to blocking/countering.
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| Why just groin kicks? Why not groin hits, and eye rakes, and stuff. Seems odd to add one thing (rpesumably for realism) and not others. |
well groin punches are not really very applicable from a standup fighting point of view. There are some tecniques that are difficult to practice with ie biting, eye gougin etc..
but I was speaking on groin kicks particulary because as I said they are a common technique from avg "joe thug". |
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JerryLove
Black Belt
Joined: 19 Sep 2002
Posts: 1274
Location: Tampa, FL, US
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| Posted: Tue Apr 01, 2003 4:42 pm Post subject: |
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| I understand the point you are making but I dont think it quite applies for this, You can get your shins used to kicking..you can condition your knuckles for punching, you can to taking a hit, but Honetly i dont think you can get used to getting kicked in the groin..it's going to hurt no matter what..but you can get used to blocking/countering. |
You can also get used to many bad habits. And actually yex, you can condiion for groin hits.
That said, the question is "why did we add it?". We added it because we wanted more realism in our sparring situations.. ok, why not add shoes?
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| well groin punches are not really very applicable from a standup fighting point of view. There are some tecniques that are difficult to practice with ie biting, eye gougin etc.. |
Slaps to the groin are not difficult to perform standing... and why assume in a self-defense school that you will be standing? Also, groin kicks are difficult to practices (as noted by the fact tat you must kick lightly / barefoot and have a cup on), so again, why train one unrealistically but not another.
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| but I was speaking on groin kicks particulary because as I said they are a common technique from avg "joe thug". |
I'd bet "groin knees" are more common.
I'm being more ranty than I really intend... there's just a few subconsious buttons that got hit... I've seen too many schools / arts / people that yell at others for not being "street-oriented" and yet have extrememly unrealistic training. (not saying you were doing that, just that that button got triggered.)
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TJS
Black Belt
Joined: 27 Jan 2003
Posts: 1843
Styles: boxing, Thai boxing, BJJ,
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| Posted: Tue Apr 01, 2003 6:13 pm Post subject: |
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| You can also get used to many bad habits. |
true, the same is true of boxing gloves. but like you said you just have to look at the ratio of help vs hurt.
And Yes we do wear shoes when we spar, we always wear shoes.
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| and why assume in a self-defense school that you will be standing? |
actually most of KM's escapes from the gaurd or mount, etc have a groin strike in there somewhere, most dont rely on it but it's an added incintive 
yes, knees to the groin are also pretty common I would say. although I have not personally done it yet i belive we do spar with those later on. |
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fungku
Orange Belt
Joined: 31 Oct 2002
Posts: 107
Styles: gong fu
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| Posted: Wed Apr 02, 2003 7:15 pm Post subject: |
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I like JerryLove's point:
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| 3. Why just groin kicks? Why not groin hits, and eye rakes, and stuff. Seems odd to add one thing (rpesumably for realism) and not others. |
If you aren't training effectively because you don't spar with groin kicks, what about eye-gouging, head-butting, biting, scratching, hair pulling, breaks, etc?
Personally, I want to have children someday, and I'm confident in my ability to protect my groin.
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- I don't fear the 10,000 techniques you've practised once, I fear the one technique you've practiced 10,000 times. - |
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TJS
Black Belt
Joined: 27 Jan 2003
Posts: 1843
Styles: boxing, Thai boxing, BJJ,
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| Posted: Wed Apr 02, 2003 11:07 pm Post subject: |
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| fungku wrote: |
I like JerryLove's point:
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| 3. Why just groin kicks? Why not groin hits, and eye rakes, and stuff. Seems odd to add one thing (rpesumably for realism) and not others. |
If you aren't training effectively because you don't spar with groin kicks, what about eye-gouging, head-butting, biting, scratching, hair pulling, breaks, etc?
Personally, I want to have children someday, and I'm confident in my ability to protect my groin. |
biting/eye gouging/hair pulling are not similar to groin kicks in any way
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| and I'm confident in my ability to protect my groin |
yea and im confident in my ability to block punches..but i never practice it  ..whats the diffrence? |
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fungku
Orange Belt
Joined: 31 Oct 2002
Posts: 107
Styles: gong fu
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| Posted: Thu Apr 03, 2003 8:55 am Post subject: |
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| TJS wrote: |
biting/eye gouging/hair pulling are not similar to groin kicks in any way
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To me they are similar. Eye-gouging and breaks are things that can cause permanent damage, like groin kicks.
All of them are things that could happen in a fight. So saying that groin kicks are also something that could be used against you , and saying that it is necessary to spar with these to be properly prepared, it is only logical that you should want to spar with all these other possibilities as well? Right?
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| yea and im confident in my ability to block punches..but i never practice it ..whats the diffrence? |
I know that if someone goes for my groin, I'll most likely be able to defend it like any other part of my body, despite not sparring with them specifically.
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- I don't fear the 10,000 techniques you've practised once, I fear the one technique you've practiced 10,000 times. - |
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TJS
Black Belt
Joined: 27 Jan 2003
Posts: 1843
Styles: boxing, Thai boxing, BJJ,
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| Posted: Thu Apr 03, 2003 9:32 am Post subject: |
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| no, you cant get good at defending hair pulling or biting ...anyone can do it theny dont take any skill. |
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fungku
Orange Belt
Joined: 31 Oct 2002
Posts: 107
Styles: gong fu
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| Posted: Thu Apr 03, 2003 9:42 am Post subject: |
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What about the breaks, and eye-gouging?
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- I don't fear the 10,000 techniques you've practised once, I fear the one technique you've practiced 10,000 times. - |
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TJS
Black Belt
Joined: 27 Jan 2003
Posts: 1843
Styles: boxing, Thai boxing, BJJ,
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| Posted: Thu Apr 03, 2003 10:44 am Post subject: |
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| fungku wrote: |
| What about the breaks, and eye-gouging? |
well if you are refering to breaks as in Arm bars/leg locks etc..then you practice 100% yes...you relese the hold when they tap out...if they tap out you know they were unable to get out of the position and had to submit to avoid a break.
thats the great thing about Grappling you can practice 100%
eye gouging...once again it does not take much skill and you cant really spar with it...eye gouging is more of a grappling move..close range combat..it not that easy to poke someone in the eye like a punch...we do parctice drills though. |
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fungku
Orange Belt
Joined: 31 Oct 2002
Posts: 107
Styles: gong fu
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| Posted: Thu Apr 03, 2003 10:50 am Post subject: |
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So practicing drills with groin kicks is an acceptable replacement for sparring with groin kicks?
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- I don't fear the 10,000 techniques you've practised once, I fear the one technique you've practiced 10,000 times. - |
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on the post.
