The Death Touch

Warp Spider · Brown Belt

"Dim Mak" points will not kill you, unless you are below 15 or over 50.

A healty person will have no trouble restarting their heart if you disrupt it, jogging the brain causes only momentary "punch drunk"-edness, and twisting the spinal cord, well, that hurts quite a bit and is a pain in the butt, people have tried that to me numerous times... but it didn't cause unconciousness or death, by any stretch. Pressure points cause pain, but pain is just nerve stimulation, and can be resisted. Eventually, enough pain would cause unconciousness, but that generally requires a GREAT deal of pain, like being crushed by a tank, or smashed into a wall by a car.

Here's a point by point debunking of the list posted above:

1: The "soft spot": This hurts. It also, for some reason, makes me feel very angry and frustrated to get hit here. I've cracked it a couple of times, but that was through impacts with concrete, typically at high speeds, as a result of bicycling accidents, etc. This hurt a lot, but even when split right open did not cause unconciousness. (though I imagine a person in that situation might rethink their desire to fight)

2: This makes you dizzy for a second, but it passes. I find it to have a similar infuriating effect to #1.

3: The temple: Theoretically capable of killing a person, but you're not Mas Oyama. Quite painful but not easy to hit. This area also seems to lack the dizzying effect of other head pressure points.

4: Eyes: Eyeballs are big and are NOT easy to pop out. They are a lot bigger than they look. It can be done though, but you would have to be a lot better than your opponent in order to do it. You could still just wreck them though. Hitting a person's brain through their eyes would take not only a lot of force to break through all the nerves and whatnot, but also very long fingers. Also note that having your forebrain damaged is not likely to kill you, though it could impair your thinking ability until your brain healed. Contrary to popular belief, your brain can usually heal itself if damaged, but some types of damage (like strokes) don't heal very well.

5: Ears: Simply put, not true. Air will escape from your ears on almost all people. Ears are shaped differently on everyone, but usually you will not be able to make a good seal over the ear with your hands. As an interesting side-note, some people don't have ears. (Don't laugh, it's true, I met a guy who had no ears, just holes and little stumps that were probrably some kind of undeveloped ear, but he could still hear.)

6: Behind the earlobes: Simply... you can't be serious. This isn't even painful, but I'd believe that you could damage a persons ear with prolonged pressure. However, prolonged pressure takes time, and it has relatively little benefit.

7: II-A: Breaking the nose: Big deal.
II-D: Forcing the nose bones into the brain: This is a myth. It is nearly impossible to do and doesn't result in death even if successful. Your brain can be compressed a fair bit before it will cause any real harm. Similar effect to a migraine headache.

8: "Upper lip": Generates a "tingling" effect in your face. Cool, but not that effective.

9: Breaking the jaw: Unpleasant, but it won't kill anyone.

10: Chin: A decent place to hit, but it's not a pressure point and won't kill anyone unless you are The Hulk. KO is actually achieved by twisting the spinal cord, not by a shock sensor.

11: Corotid/Jugular: Hitting people in the neck is no secret, and no pressure point. Regardless, although this hurts, it won't kill anyone. The notion that you could burst one of these with a punch is ludicrous. The throat is a better target on the neck.

12: The Throat: Not a pressure point, but it still hurts and can cause a person to feel like they are choking. This is actually a very good place to hit because the person believes they are choking, although they are not. Drowning a person in their own blood is just plain fantasy.

13: Tingling effect. Kind of cool.

14: Between the collarbones: Sure thing, Conan. If you have enough power to do this you might as well just rip out the heart and squeeze it in front of their eyes.

15: Breaking bones is always a good thing to inflict on your target. This is no different.

16: The heart: If you think you can kill a healthy person by stopping their heart, your opponent had better be 65 or a heavy smoker. Most people's heart can restart itself after being jarred, unless they are already unconcious. Even then they sometimes can. Collapsing a heart does nothing. The heart collapses parts of itself deliberately as part of it's operation.

17. Mmmm, kidney punching: I don't know how this qualifies as a pressure point, but whatever. Punching the kidneys is always a good target because it's pretty painful. Internal bleeding - not likely, takes a long time, and is easily fixed at the hospital.

18. Dislocating a shoulder: Same as breaking a bone, except you can put it back in place quite easily, even during the fight.

19. Breaking an arm at the elbow: Not a pressure point, but again, breaking bones does work pretty good.

20. Breaking fingers: Again, this isn't a pressure point. It's just breaking bones.

21. Dislodging the kneecap: Not as easy as it sounds. It isn't easy to land a downward strike to a person's kneecap. Even then, it's not the end of the world.

22. Stomping on people's foot: Wow, Mr. Science, I bet noone thought of this before! Again, this is just bone breaking.

23. Broken bone's. Nuff said.

24. Same here. Just bone breaking.

25. Uhh, it's nearly impossible to break the spine by striking it unless you are brittle and don't drink milk. It's quite flexible. Try snapping a rope.

26. Attacking the diapraghm. Knocks the wind out of you. Not fatal by any stretch.

27. Testes: This one hurts, but not THAT bad. Not bad enough to save you from being sticked/shot/whatever.

28. The "tailbone": This hurts and makes a tingling feeling over your entire body. It will not kill a person, however, unless you are, say, a polar bear.

29. Getting hit in the armpits hurts, but since its' surrounded by bones it's basically impossible to hit with a fist. You can jab it with fingers, but still, it won't kill someone or immobilize them as the article says.

30. Back of the upper leg: Hurts. No other serious effects.

31. The liver: Yes. Let's hit the guy ON HIS LIVER. Technically the liver can be damaged easily, except for the fact that it's buried in your body and cushioned by your flesh. A strong hit to the liver could kill you, but so would the suggestion in #14, which would probrably be easier.

32. The spleen: This is different from the liver because although it contains a lot of blood, it is not hard like the liver and does not break easily. If you can break a spleen with a punch, see #14.

For obvious reasons, I can't blame you for not trying these before you posted a reference to another article, probrably by people who also haven't tried it.

Breaking bones doesn't qualify as pressure points, and trying to break a bone with the intention of a jagged bone end puncturing an organ is kind of silly. By their nature, bones very rarely break in such a manner that promotes them to move around and puncture things.

These "pressure points" are mostly based on theories which are not supported by experimental data. There are not "magical" spots that you can kill a person merely by touching. If you could there'd be a lot more people just lying around dead because they tripped and fell funny, or whatever.
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JerryLove · Black Belt

I want to address a few in particular.

5. Blows to the ears can and will break ear-drums. I put up many cites in my post in the Combative Arts section

http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&ie=UTF-8&oe=UTF-8&q=ruptured+eardrum+blow
http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&lr=&ie=UTF-8&oe=UTF-8&safe=off&q=ruptured+eardrum+fight

6. George Dillman readily demonstrates this knock-out on anyone who voulenteers.

10. Is intended to trigger 6.

12. I don't see any reason why not.. but admit I'm not coming across cases of this.

16. Improper chest compression can cause hearts to flutter and go into arythmia... This is something reinforced in any CPR traning.

26. Many strikes/spots will cause cramping of the diagphram.. making contrinued breathing difficult.

27. varies heavily by the nature of the hit.

29. It's like a floating rib but worse... but yes, very hard to hit.

28 and 30. It is possibleto do nerve damage with sufficient hits in this ares. The siataic is quite damageable from teh buttox. The Coxix is best hit upward and can be rather debilitating.

It's also worth noting that most energetic-hits require not onlt a particular point.. but a particular type of strike.

A few months ago, I was at a resturaunt and needed to scoot my chair up. So I grabbed the seat, scooted forward and put my weight back down. Well, one finger had gotten between the seat and the leg, and BAM!.

It caused some bleeding under my nail, and hurt... but what suprised me was that I got hot and sweaty and nauseous... I've been hurt far worst.. but it was the right damage, at teh right place, at the right time.
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YoungGrasshopper · Yellow Belt

Ic...well obviously I have not experienced these phenominal pressure points to make your nails bleed from hit under...or fall down when someone strokes you back. So, I will have no further say.

StoneSkin · Orange Belt

Persoanlly id develop incredible grip strength if you wanted to apply some of these pressure points. I think it would make them far more effective.
There are some "grip trainers" that can bend pipes roll up frying pans like newspapers and lots of other neat little stunts. If anyone wants to hear more about these look up captain of crush on some search engine do a little digging and youll read soem interesting facts.

If a person could develop there grip strength so they could crush bones just by squeezing them. These Dim mak techniques would be a lot more effective.

Drunken Monkey · Black Belt

in my wing chun we are told about certain points that we aim to intercept (point before the elbow on the outside of the forearm, back of the hand, crook of the elbow) and some others for hitting.

we aim for these points because it makes out blocks/intercepts more effective.

as to whether or not they are pressure points, i have no idea but even applying a little more pressure on them does cause more pain.
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Sens55 · Orange Belt

I don't think anyone who has ever hit their "funny bone" can refute the fact that pressure points exist. And, yes, a few can be lethal. But I doubt whether or not a strike can cause death at a later point like some proponents of Dim Mak will contend. It is worth noting, though, that some things that might have mystified can now be explained. I'm sure every one of us has learned some variation of a shudo to a carotid artery. However, I work out with one doctor who got VERY upset when he was lightly popped on there. It wasn't that it hurt him, it was, as he explained that anyone over 30 might have build up of plaque in the artery that even a slight, but direct jarring, might dislodge leading to a potential stroke.

Maybe the illusive Dim Mak is attempting to explain this from their ancient point of reference. Just a thought.

shotokanwarrior · Green Belt

I am not going to let anyone get close enough to stroke my back... lol, but yes i believe they work
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wrestlingkaratechamp17 · Brown Belt

Nice post warp

Warp Spider · Brown Belt

Pressure points exist for sure. But the notion of a dim mak point is a pressure point that is supposedly so sensitive that you could kill a person, a HEALTHY person, just by striking it. That I would definately disagree with. Like I've said, many of these I've had people try on me, and although some of them hurt a lot, and some made my feel kind of tingly, I wouldn't call that death.
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JerryLove · Black Belt

The points in question require a certain way of striking and a certain energy put into them. I've certainly been made "sick" by playing with such things (sometimes taking me an hour to fix energetically), but I've not seen/felt something I could definately say was fatal... of course, I can't discount the idea either.
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