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humble monk
Yellow Belt
Joined: 13 Aug 2008
Posts: 90
Styles: Tang Soo Do
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 Posted: Fri Aug 15, 2008 8:42 am Post subject: |
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Saw a video somewhere of guys with European swords cutting MASSIVE tatami mats. Ridiculously effective, changed my whole outlook on the subject.
So my question becomes, could there really be much of a difference between Japanese and European technique? I really think there are only so many ways to slash, thrust, block and parry with a two handed sword. Am I missing something? |
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bushido_man96
KF Sensei
Joined: 31 Mar 2006
Posts: 13977
Location: Hays, KS
Styles: Taekwondo, Combat Hapkido, Aikido, and I research Medieval Combat
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| Posted: Sun Aug 17, 2008 2:43 am Post subject: |
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| humble monk wrote: |
Saw a video somewhere of guys with European swords cutting MASSIVE tatami mats. Ridiculously effective, changed my whole outlook on the subject.
So my question becomes, could there really be much of a difference between Japanese and European technique? I really think there are only so many ways to slash, thrust, block and parry with a two handed sword. Am I missing something? |
No, you're not missing anything. The truth is that there are many similarities between Medieval European and Japanese Swordsmanship, technique wise.
Pick up some Medieval Combat manuals, and you can really see the similarities. Truly, combat is universal.
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humble monk
Yellow Belt
Joined: 13 Aug 2008
Posts: 90
Styles: Tang Soo Do
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| Posted: Sun Aug 17, 2008 9:37 am Post subject: |
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| Bushido Man, allow me to ask this : I see you are involved with SCA. I have some Korean sword, and a little Japanese sword, but qualified instructors are rare in my area. I've had a passion for swordsmanship since I was a child. Does the SCA teach sword? I sought out a chapter in my area, they occaisioally do demonstrations, would a membership be a worthwhile? And what is involved? Thanks! |
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tallgeese
Black Belt
Joined: 04 May 2008
Posts: 1020
Location: McHenry County, IL
Styles: 2 forms of kempo, MMA, grappling, boxing, kickboxing
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| Posted: Sun Aug 17, 2008 4:50 pm Post subject: |
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Ok, not bushido man, but I did fight in the SCA. I would still except for time constraints.
In my opinion, yes, it's very worth the time. There are those who will throw the "historical accuracy" arguement out and yes, there are plenty of things that are disallowed.
That being said, you get a good feel for what different weapons function like and it's a blast. Being a full-contact sport is pretty neat to.
Be prepared to either shell out some serious time to make armor, or serious coin to buy it. Most groups have a starter set they will loan you to get you fighting. It's worth it, look for a good group. |
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humble monk
Yellow Belt
Joined: 13 Aug 2008
Posts: 90
Styles: Tang Soo Do
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| Posted: Sun Aug 17, 2008 7:24 pm Post subject: |
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| Tallgeese, explain the construction of the sword to me. What I saw was rattan, but mounted to a basket-hilt. How is this done, and are there any other requirements for the weapon to be allowed in sparring? |
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tallgeese
Black Belt
Joined: 04 May 2008
Posts: 1020
Location: McHenry County, IL
Styles: 2 forms of kempo, MMA, grappling, boxing, kickboxing
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| Posted: Mon Aug 18, 2008 6:30 am Post subject: |
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Yup, rattan weapons. The length requirement will vary by your region of the country. They must be taped as to not allow splintering and the cutting edge will be maked by a different color tape. Thrusting is allowed with an extra foam "thrusting tip" built to the end of the weapon. Controled to the front of the face is key w/ thrusting.
For sword and shield work, a basket hilt is usually mounted (an easy procedure). For great sword and two-stick I usually wore hockey gloves with some leather suppliments. Then again, I was always into the sport aspect. The authenticity people will build full gauntlets for this type of thing. |
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bushido_man96
KF Sensei
Joined: 31 Mar 2006
Posts: 13977
Location: Hays, KS
Styles: Taekwondo, Combat Hapkido, Aikido, and I research Medieval Combat
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| Posted: Mon Aug 18, 2008 8:27 am Post subject: |
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Tallgeese is on the money here. The SCA, although not completely accurate as far as historical swordsmanship goes, is still a lot of fun, and it gives you some ideas as to how to work a sword. You can still learn the cuts and parrys, but what you have to watch for is that the SCA runs on almost like a point system for their fights. When a limb is "rent" then it must be removed from the fight, like arm behnd the back, or kneeling when a leg is cut, etc.
In the end, it is fun, and I think you would enjoy it, if you like Medieval European culture and history.
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Success is where preparation meets opportunity.
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bushido_man96
KF Sensei
Joined: 31 Mar 2006
Posts: 13977
Location: Hays, KS
Styles: Taekwondo, Combat Hapkido, Aikido, and I research Medieval Combat
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| Posted: Thu Aug 21, 2008 1:14 am Post subject: |
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| Sengra wrote: |
| I have been fencing for 5 years too...the problem is, I want to know classical fencing too... |
Hey, Sengra. Sorry it took so long to get back with ya, but I found those titles:
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Renaissance Swordsmanship
John Clements |
Honestly, anything that you can find and read by Clements, regardless of the weapon focus, is top shelf. This guy researches hard, and knows his stuff.
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Art of Defence An Introduction to the Use of the Rapier
William Wilson |
This guy has an SCA background as well as a Fencing background. A pretty good read, and has a very basic, understandable approach.
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Art of Dueling Salvator Fabris’ rapier fencing treatise of 1606
Tommaso Leoni |
This is a translation and interpretation of Salvator Fabris' book. Much more in-depth, but very good.
Now, the Fencing style, even the more classical ones, aren't really my cup of tea, but these books are still enjoyable.
_________________
Success is where preparation meets opportunity.
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humble monk
Yellow Belt
Joined: 13 Aug 2008
Posts: 90
Styles: Tang Soo Do
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| Posted: Thu Aug 21, 2008 11:06 am Post subject: |
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Not to try to hijack this, but since there are knoledgable people on this subject here,
1) Does a rapier have an edge (edges), or is it solely a thrusting weapon? I've seen museum pieces that appeared to be triangular bars with a point, but no edge. Of course, in the movies, you can slash ropes, candles, etc. with its razor sharp edge. I'm confused.
2) Is there a manufacturer who makes historically accurate yet functional swords. I'm interested in collecting a variety of styles, but not the fantasy/ wallhanger trash.
Thanks guys. |
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bushido_man96
KF Sensei
Joined: 31 Mar 2006
Posts: 13977
Location: Hays, KS
Styles: Taekwondo, Combat Hapkido, Aikido, and I research Medieval Combat
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| Posted: Fri Aug 22, 2008 12:34 am Post subject: |
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| humble monk wrote: |
| 1) Does a rapier have an edge (edges), or is it solely a thrusting weapon? I've seen museum pieces that appeared to be triangular bars with a point, but no edge. Of course, in the movies, you can slash ropes, candles, etc. with its razor sharp edge. I'm confused. |
It will depend on the era you are looking at, but the "classical" rapiers were edged. They were cut and thrust weapons.
| humble monk wrote: |
| 2) Is there a manufacturer who makes historically accurate yet functional swords. I'm interested in collecting a variety of styles, but not the fantasy/ wallhanger trash. |
For rapier, I am not sure. There probably is, but I would have to do some searching. As for Medieval long swords, I have some sites that I can list; I'll just have to dig them up. I'll get back soon with them.
Thanks guys.[/quote]
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on the post.
