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sensei8
KF Sensei
Joined: 23 Feb 2008
Posts: 16420
Location: Las Vegas, NV
Styles: Shindokan Saitou-ryu [Shuri-te/Okinawa-te based]
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 Posted: Sun Sep 20, 2015 11:03 pm Post subject: |
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| Luther unleashed wrote: |
Thanks sensei8, you know I really do get what your saying and I aprθciate the time you took to say it. I am not stressing it as much as it might seem, but the reason I made the thread was to understand potentially how I site amongs other new teachers, old teachers and so on. Not to brag, or to beat myself up, but to simply measure as my curiosity gets the best of me... How good am I really doing, and most curious I am to understand "what is normal" or common.
I do understand that turnover is a common thing in martial arts and very much for the reasons you have specified. I saw it when I just trained prior to teaching, I noticed it then. The thing is, I suppose I care more about how many don't leave, the. How many I have. It's impossible to please everybody for sure, but that's hard for me to accept.
As for how many I want? Let me be honest with you! I want to make a living, and I charge a bit less then half of the going rate of stand alone studios. I actually start teaching at my second location tomorrow, and we are still at a similar price. What it means for me is that because I have made a strong run at offering martial arts for less then many competitors, and targeted lower income families/areas, I need more students to benefit financially. I hate to think about numbers this way but to make a living I must think about these things. At my first location, the previous program had 33 for some time, my personal goal was 40, so I'm right there near my. Dry realistic goal. At my second location I hope to accomplish the same. Realistically I can handle as many as about 15 a class without issues, that's 4 classes so the ultimate goal with the help and facilities I have now is about 60 at each school, I guess we will see if I'm really that good of a teacher huh?
I like what you are getting at, I have been telling my wife it's like that movie about baseball, I can't remember the name as Iv never. Den a baseball person but there's this constant phrase "if you build it, they will come"! I believe in this,similarly to what your saying. And BTW your numbers are the impressive ones, certainly not mine. Take care. |
I believe that you'll be just fine; just keep doing what you're doing, and you're student body will reciprocate accordingly.
Btw, Field Of Dreams, that's the movie...starring, Kevin Costner!!
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**Proof is on the floor!!! |
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Hawkmoon
Pre-Black Belt
Joined: 17 Jun 2013
Posts: 891
Location: MK in the UK
Styles: Kyokushin
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| Posted: Mon Sep 21, 2015 4:20 am Post subject: |
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My Style is Kyokushin, the turnover rate is 80-90%
When 2012 became 2013 the new year we had a large collection of new students.
Its a wonderful site to see new faces in the hall all lined up looking the best part of not worried! 
Sadly come session or few later, as a general rule that number has dwindled to single figures.
2013
session 1
12 new starters,
session 2
4 returned.
session 3
3
and so on for a while.
session 5
1 remained.
5 ths later ... 0.
Over that year I think about 16 new faces appeared, and of that only 2 are still with us!
_________________
A human life gains luster and strength only when it is polished and tempered.
Sosai Masutatsu Oyama (1923 - 1994) Founder of Kyokushin Karate.
Last edited by Hawkmoon on Wed Sep 23, 2015 5:41 am; edited 1 time in total |
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Luther unleashed
Brown Belt
Joined: 30 Jan 2014
Posts: 676
Location: Phoenix
Styles: A few!
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| Posted: Wed Sep 23, 2015 12:09 am Post subject: |
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| Hawkmoon wrote: |
My Style is Kyokushin, the turnover rate is 80-90%
When 2012 became 2013 the new year we had a large collection of new students.
Its a wonderful site to see new faces in the hall all lined up looking the best part of not worried!
Sadly come session, as a general rule that number has dwindled to single figures.
2013
session 1
12 new starters,
session 2
4 returned.
session 3
3
and so on for a while.
session 5
1 remained.
5 ths later ... 0.
Over that year I think about 16 new faces appeared, and of that only 2 are still with us! |
I don't think having more student turnover is a bad thing. Especially if the style (like yours) is a bit more rigid or hard, for lack of a better word. The numbers can be very misleading. I'm happy with my numbers as I want to be successful, but it's quite possible to teach an effective program and have low numbers, especially these days when so many lack the follow through and drive to really go far in the world of martial arts.
I respect your style very much and find it to be entertaining.
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Hustle and hard work are a substitute for talent! |
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Luther unleashed
Brown Belt
Joined: 30 Jan 2014
Posts: 676
Location: Phoenix
Styles: A few!
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| Posted: Wed Sep 23, 2015 12:10 am Post subject: |
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And thanks for that sensei8, the positive words and the name of the movie lol!
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Hustle and hard work are a substitute for talent! |
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The Pred
Green Belt
Joined: 26 Jun 2003
Posts: 385
Styles: Goju Ryu
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| Posted: Wed Sep 23, 2015 7:55 am Post subject: |
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| This got me thinking, out of the 300 million people in America. How many altogether, does everyone think have done martial arts including those whose still does it.Whether it have been for years, or even a week. My guess it would be a high number. Perhaps in the millions. |
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Luther unleashed
Brown Belt
Joined: 30 Jan 2014
Posts: 676
Location: Phoenix
Styles: A few!
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| Posted: Fri Sep 25, 2015 1:49 pm Post subject: |
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| The Pred wrote: |
| This got me thinking, out of the 300 million people in America. How many altogether, does everyone think have done martial arts including those whose still does it.Whether it have been for years, or even a week. My guess it would be a high number. Perhaps in the millions. |
That is an interesting angle, you know I meet people all the time that asked me what I do for a living. I tell them I teach martial arts. Most of them all think that that is very cool, and they offer up that at some point they used to take a martial arts, 90% of the time they tell me it is taekwondo.
You're right, I think there is absolutely no way to figure this out and the number would be consistently fluctuating but I do think it would be an extremely high rate and above half of the population in America at least, that has taken it at some point.
The percentage of people that still do it actively, or have at least made it to black belt I would say is much much less, because I think many people try martial arts but not many stick with it with the type of dedication that most of the forum members here have, I think we are part of the few and I think that's why we all kind of get each other even if we don't always agree on particular styles or techniques, we just have something that we all get about each other. I don't think that most people would find discussing the things that we discuss, entertaining LOL
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Maybetrue
Yellow Belt
Joined: 25 Sep 2015
Posts: 78
Location: USA
Styles: karate
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| Posted: Mon Sep 28, 2015 1:25 am Post subject: |
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Here are some interesting numbers:
stage 1 (110% effort and teaching 4 times a week 4-6 hours total)
-Peak membership when i was competing and just retired competing.
-150 - 200 students divide between 2 rec centers 15 miles apart.
-teaching 2 times a week and 2 one hour classes at each rec center.
-Biggest class was about 60 students.
Stage #2 - 75% effort(marriage and new child)
Teaching 2 times a week , once at both recs with another instructor (highest rank that shows up) teaching the other classes.
student membership went down to approx 100.
stage #3 - 25% effort(opened a new business,not karate related) teaching about once a month at both dojos, with other instructors(highest ranked) teaching the rest.
students drop down to approx 50-70 students.
stage#4 - 10% effort(making money in my none karate business) for about 4 years.
only go to grade every 3 months , no teaching (appointed a few of the higher ranks to teach assigned days)
45 students average .
stage #5 40% effort (sold my NON karate business)
began teaching again twice a week 1 hour(advance class) at each rec. (appointed instructors teach other classes)
75 students.
stage #6 10% effort(moved to another state)
instructors are running the 2 dojos. only go back once in a few years for dan testing. (Appointed BOARD of instructors to run the club as Non-profit)
membership is around 50-75 with students that I have not actually teaching making shodan this past couple years.
Stage #6a
Basically the 2 dojos are now able to start growing without me being there and the true instructors are now taking control(after some turmoil the first few years after i left). Two instructors have separated themselves from the other instructors and now are appointed the head instructor of each branch to do as please. But during kyu testing 4 highest training black belts sit at the front to grade.
Teaching is the easy part, it is finding out how to continue the ART when you are "gone" is the difficult part.
ALSO, the politics within the dojo is the worse part of Martial Arts.
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Luther unleashed
Brown Belt
Joined: 30 Jan 2014
Posts: 676
Location: Phoenix
Styles: A few!
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| Posted: Mon Sep 28, 2015 9:06 am Post subject: |
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Those are good numbers, congrats on your success! I hear you about the drama in a dojo. I personally have none and I feel blessed but this is because it's me and my family I.E. Wife and kids. When I was a part of my previous school that gave me my start teaching it got stupid with adults in particular. Jealousy, different ideas of what was right, not following technique and teaching it right, ego yada yada. Don't miss that at all.
impressive numbers though, I think I'd be as big as I can handle alone at 50 to 60 students in the 4 classes I do, don't think I could handle your numbers but time will tell lol!
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Luther unleashed
Brown Belt
Joined: 30 Jan 2014
Posts: 676
Location: Phoenix
Styles: A few!
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| Posted: Wed Nov 11, 2015 6:40 am Post subject: |
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So, I contisuosly update the first post with my numbers . Part of the reason I do it is that I'm so bad at bookkeeping that for a while this was the only record lol. The other, is that I think it's a cool thing to share with the karate forums community, to watch the progression from day one on. It's putting my business out there a bit, and sometimes in doing that it's hard because not everything is everybkdies buisness BUT I always like to push myself to be open about things. 34 students, I'd like to see 40 at this point but I'm thankful for my success thus far so I'm not complaining , just pushing.
1st month - 7 students
2nd month - 14 students
3rd month - 20 students
4th month - 20 students
5th month - 21 students
6th month - 31 students
7th month - 26 students
8th month - 33 students
9th month - 37 students
10th month - 31 students
11th month - 34 students
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Hustle and hard work are a substitute for talent! |
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sensei8
KF Sensei
Joined: 23 Feb 2008
Posts: 16420
Location: Las Vegas, NV
Styles: Shindokan Saitou-ryu [Shuri-te/Okinawa-te based]
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| Posted: Wed Nov 11, 2015 9:50 pm Post subject: |
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| Luther unleashed wrote: |
So, I contisuosly update the first post with my numbers . Part of the reason I do it is that I'm so bad at bookkeeping that for a while this was the only record lol. The other, is that I think it's a cool thing to share with the karate forums community, to watch the progression from day one on. It's putting my business out there a bit, and sometimes in doing that it's hard because not everything is everybkdies buisness BUT I always like to push myself to be open about things. 34 students, I'd like to see 40 at this point but I'm thankful for my success thus far so I'm not complaining , just pushing.
1st month - 7 students
2nd month - 14 students
3rd month - 20 students
4th month - 20 students
5th month - 21 students
6th month - 31 students
7th month - 26 students
8th month - 33 students
9th month - 37 students
10th month - 31 students
11th month - 34 students |
You should be very proud of these numbers!! You're showing increases more than you're showing decreases; which of course, is normal to expect...but you're student body is growing.
Do you have a number in mind that you'd like to reach??
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**Proof is on the floor!!! |
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on the post.
