A grappling art, and a striking art

bushido_man96 · KF Sensei

Just for fun, lets take these two modes of fighting as a basis, and see what combinations are available to you, or you have trained in, and talk about their compliments and pros/cons.

I'll start with TKD as a striking style, because that is what I have studied for the past almost 14 years. And I'll add wrestling (high school style), as that is about the only style of grappling available to me.

TKD is great because it teaches good solid blocking and striking skills. Great kicks, even though they teach a lot of high kicks. My thought on this is that if you can kick high, then you can kick low if you need to. Good combination training too. Along with the kicking is the benefit of flexibility, as most TKD schools have a good stretching routine. Flexibility helps to prevent injuries to muscles.

Also, in TKD you can learn to block and counter, or to counter without blocking, although most of this countering is done soley with kicking techniques.

Wrestling is great for several reasons. Conditioning is one. Wrestlers are some of the most conditioned athletes in the world. Wrestling practice can be done much in the same manner as judo, full speed, and with fairly safe outcomes. As a wrestler, you can get a good solid base to working on takedowns, escapes, and groundwork. The only downfall to wrestling in this style is that it mostly works toward a pin or scoring points, as opposed to locking and submitting.

This is just an example. Try to keep it to one striking style, and one grappling style, just for the sake of argument.

And I know that there has been a very extensive thread about karate containing groundfighting/grappling, and I don't want this thread to be another one of those. So, for the sake of argument, we will consider karate primarily (but not soley

) a striking/stand-up style.

Let me know what you think!
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cathal · Black Belt

I'm happy that you aren't trying to get a strike vs grapple debate.

For me it is Karate and Jiu-Jitsu. Pros for Karate would be the internal exercises to help train your mind as well as the physical aspect. Different techniques can be adapted based on distance from the opponent, and emphasis is definitely placed on striking, and blocking. I don't like that some of the on-ground techniques are ignored.

Jiu-Jitsu has an emphasis on balance displacement techniques, throws (and takedowns), joint manipulation, restraints and immobilizations, and of course ground grappling. But I didn't get a good feel for defence against multiple opponents, or any of the internal exercises that I enjoyed in Karate.
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The best victory is when the opponent surrenders
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bushido_man96 · KF Sensei

Good reply, cathal. I think it is hard to get a good feeling vs. multiple opponents with a ground fighting art, as it tends to get very one-on-one.
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atalaya · Yellow Belt

i have to say coming from basically a karate background that to end a fight i had to hurt my opponent enough that he either realized the error of his ways (unlikely) or he was unable to continue attacking. this left some longer term effects on them and inhibited in some ways their daily lives.
recently i've been practicing some grappling with a good friend who is an instructor in a different style and i have been able to put submissions and chokes into a practical application where my opponent doesn't have to be injured to give up and as a plus if i need him to move afterwards i don't have to carry him.
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Ace2021 · Blue Belt

alsey · Purple Belt

i don't like to label either karate or jujitsu as striking or grappling arts, because they both contain both, but cathal put it pretty well. i find the two work well together.
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McNerny · Orange Belt

The two arts I practice are Shotokan karate and wrestling.

My striking style is Shotokan karate. Shotokan obviously teaches striking principles, providing strikes, blocks, counters and footwork. Although our sparring is not as "hardcore" as kickboxers or kyokushin karateka, in the upper ranks pretty much full contact to the body is allowed as well as sweeps and striking to the downed opponent. Our techniques to the head are controlled, but our sparring gives us a sense of realism and builds a certain degree of toughness and helps the fighter deal with the stress involved in an actual street fight. Apart from the physical aspects of karate, it also focuses on character development and discipline. This can help the karateka in many aspects of life.

The grappling style I do is wrestling. Wrestling provides good takedowns, and takedown defense, escapes and reversals. Wrestlers are good at controlling their opponent once a fight hits the ground. It also is great for conditioning. It is practiced full-on, and the wrestler soon is accustomed to the feel of such practice. The attitude and desire to win in a wrestling match can be transferred into a real fight. As it was mentioned before, a downfall is that it focuses on pins and points rather than submissions. This is true, and these are the type of matches that I train for in wrestling. But, I was lucky enough to have a wrestling coach who trained under the submission specialist, Gokor Chivichyan. My wrestling coach was versed in submissions, so I was instructed in this aspect of combat as well, creating a well-rounded grappling system for fighting. However, even without submissions, if you can keep from getting taken down, if you can escape postions once you are on the ground, if you can slam your opponent on the ground and control him there, you should have no problem either standing up if you are more comfortable there, or taking your opponent down, controlling him and finishing him with a ground and pound style attack.

Shotokan karate and wrestling compliment each other well and give obvious benefit to the practioner. This combination works great for me.

McNerny

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A good technique is beautiful but a beautiful technique is not always good.
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UseoForce · Pre-Black Belt

I want to add that merely training in a striking art and a grappling art DOES NOT make you a well rounded fighter.

For example, if you do BJJ on Tues and Thursday, and train Muay Thai on Saturday, you still aren't a well rounded fighter. You also need to know how to put those two styles together into a cohesive system. You need to be able to use both styles fluidly. Mark Hatmaker addresses this in his book, Savage Strikes.
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RicksonFan · Yellow Belt

I actually know several people who started out in TKD and then modified their knowledge to a thai-boxing style with thai elbows and kicks and so on.

I also know a lot of great BJJers who started out in wrestling and know how to move, do and defend takedowns already, and I wished I'd wrestled before I started BJJ.

So those two, while not my first choice, are not a bad way to have started either.

Mistassailant5 · Orange Belt

Shaolin Kung Fu and Aikido

Shaolin Kung Fu covers all of the striking you will ever need, and with very good results

Aikido is good if you need to face multiple opponents and the movements in Aikido and Kung Fu are very similar. Only downfall is the lack of grappling, but what can you do

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