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Kickbutt
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PostPosted: Fri Aug 03, 2001 8:56 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Magicians can do that too - and as for television, there is such a thing as special effects...

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Taesujutsudrw
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PostPosted: Fri Aug 03, 2001 10:34 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hi guys,
The infrared camera showed that the heat looked like fire...but it is really just heat.

There is nothing mystical about Ki..It is just learning how to use and control the energy of the body..and the energy around you.

In the 50's, 60's amd early 70's..a lot pf photographers whork on the idea of photographing the energy that the body ..or other living things give off.

Kerlin photography is the result. with this photography..you can acually hpotograph the enrey that is being given off by the body.
All liveing things give off enenrgy..including plats..trees and what ever.

Qi Gong is learning to control the way you breathe..and therefore teaches you how to build energy...and draw energy from the things around you.

Peace,
Tae



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ChangWuJi
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PostPosted: Fri Aug 03, 2001 11:25 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Have you ever heard of internal Chinese Martial Arts? They are considered the best in the world, and hardest/longest to master.

Tai Chi Chuan, bagua, and Xyingyiquan are the major 3 internal boxing styles.

check out:
http://www.emptyflower.com/xingyiquan/index.html

hsing-i.com

http://home.talkcity.com/homepopup.html?url=/SpiritSt/xinyi/index.html


I also saw monks who used their chi to absorbe blows (as hard as one hit), to the gut and groin. They actually have a picture of this in various martial arts books. I also saw a picture of a monk holding abowl with his chi on his stomache and no one could pry it off. It is in the latest black belt magazine.

I know that Chi Kung is being taught. But there is more to Chi Kung than what they're teaching you in these MA schools. The real art of Chi Kung was taught only to a few of the Shaolin students, the rest was given just the basics of Chi Kung but not taught the "real" or "true" Chi Kung. Chi Kung taught today, but it's the version thats being taught that's in question.
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ChangWuJi
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PostPosted: Fri Aug 03, 2001 11:28 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Almost all of the original Shaolin monks and students were wiped out. A few got a way but like somebody stated the ones in China right now aren't the real ones but just an attempt to re-write the pass wrongs of China like the wiping out of religion, and the Shaolin monks were mostly Buddhist, so you know what happen to them. But the legendary art of Chi Kung does still exist but there are rarely anyone who knows it here.
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Kickbutt
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PostPosted: Fri Aug 03, 2001 11:32 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thank-you for your clarification Tae, I myself have felt heat/energy coming off another's hands - that was quite an amazing experience and quite frankly scared me a little - it was like this vibration of energy (leave it alone guys... ), quite amazing! He was, incidently not a martial artist.

Lori

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Tim Greer
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PostPosted: Fri Aug 03, 2001 1:45 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:

On 2001-08-03 13:25, ChangWuJi wrote:
Have you ever heard of internal Chinese Martial Arts? They are considered the best in the world, and hardest/longest to master.

Tai Chi Chuan, bagua, and Xyingyiquan are the major 3 internal boxing styles.

check out:
http://www.emptyflower.com/xingyiquan/index.html

hsing-i.com

http://home.talkcity.com/homepopup.html?url=/SpiritSt/xinyi/index.html


I also saw monks who used their chi to absorbe blows (as hard as one hit), to the gut and groin. They actually have a picture of this in various martial arts books. I also saw a picture of a monk holding abowl with his chi on his stomache and no one could pry it off. It is in the latest black belt magazine.

I know that Chi Kung is being taught. But there is more to Chi Kung than what they're teaching you in these MA schools. The real art of Chi Kung was taught only to a few of the Shaolin students, the rest was given just the basics of Chi Kung but not taught the "real" or "true" Chi Kung. Chi Kung taught today, but it's the version thats being taught that's in question.


As for being aware of internal styles, yes I am. Since you mentioned Hsing-I, I may as well make mention that John Price actually lives in my town. I also study Baguazhang, Tai Chi Chuan (Taujiquan), Taiji Chin Na (Qin Na), various Shaolin Kung Fu styles, such as Long Fist, White Crane, Shaolin Qin Na, etc. (Of course, there are many other's, but having mor to do with this thread, I mention those). These also cover Chi/Qigong and various Internal and external aspects, and more.

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Tim Greer
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PostPosted: Fri Aug 03, 2001 1:49 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:

On 2001-08-03 09:34, Karateka wrote:
IP's can be important to some programs. Look up a program called BackOrfice and see how it works. Oh, by the way, you won't find it in any major stores. It is a hacker program.



BackOrafice is only good, if someone on the other end has that trojan installed, as I'm sure you are aware. There's some other programs similar too, but all these programs require the person on the other end, to have an infected system for the connections to work. (I'm sure you probably know that too). Backorafice and the other similar programs do probes of subnets anyway, searching for any IP's that might be infected and your chances of being hit (if you were infected) have greater odds of happening from a probe, than someone specifically targetting you, hoping your system is infected -- chances of that are so slim, it'd not be worth trying.

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Tim Greer
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PostPosted: Fri Aug 03, 2001 1:51 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:

On 2001-08-03 10:19, ChangWuJi wrote:
Quote:

On 2001-08-03 03:58, Jack wrote:
I believe Chi can work to direct the body and mind's energy to do something, but walking on water, fireballs... please spare us



They had a demonstration on tv of a guy who aused fire from his hands using chi.


Like I said... like we said... again.. again.. again.. You mentioned Hsing-I, and John Price lives in my own town. Surely you must know who John Price is, if you know much about Hsing-I and it's lineage. Knowing who he is and what he knows, why wouldn't these things be known to me, or him?

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Tim Greer | xanth@digital-star.com | Phone: 530-222-7244
I study any and every style and I'm always looking to spar!!
Also, if I'm not around for a while, I'm just away training. :-)

This Message was edited by: Tim Greer on Aug 3, 2001 3:53pm
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iamrushman
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PostPosted: Sat Aug 04, 2001 4:24 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

welcome to the forum CHANGWUJI.............

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ChangWuJi
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PostPosted: Sun Aug 05, 2001 10:37 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thank you Rushman.

In Jarek's interview with Mr.Ma Chuanxu who is a Liang style Baguazhang expert these are some things he had to say (I am taking exerts from the interview):

JS: How can you develop basics?

MR.MA: The are several methods. The most basic of them is walking in a circle. It is divided into three so-called "basins" (San Pan): Lower Basin, Medium Basin and Upper Basin. Yin-Yang concept is very important as well - that's why we often call Bagua "Yin-Yang Bagua". Walking counter-clockwise is Yang, while clockwise - Yin. There are many requirements for walking practice: Hollow the Chest and Pulling Up the Back (Kong Xiong Ba Bei), Collapse the Waist (Xia Ta Yao), Twist Hips and Keep Knees Together (Niu Kua He Xi), Grasp the Ground Firmly with Toes (Zhua Di Lao); Drop the Shoulders and Sink the Elbows (Chui Jian Chen Zhou), Smooth Buttocks and Lift the Grain Path (anus) (Liu Tun Ti Gang), Three Pressing (Head Presses, Tongue Presses and Hands Press creating One Energy) and Three Round Principles (San Ding - Tou Ding She Ding Shou Ding Hunyuan Yi Qi - San Yuan). Only if all these requirements are strictly observed Internal Qi (Nei Qi) will appear and Neigong (Internal Skill) will develop. Once Neigong develops, it's like electricity in hands.

JS: What do you mean "electricity in hands"?

MR.MA: The Intent becomes important. Intent drives Qi and Qi drives Strength (Yi Dai Qi Qi Dai Li). One has to develop Qi of Dantian to make use of it - and only then we can call it Neigong.

JS: So what is "Neigong"?

MR.MA: Neigong is Dantian. You have to attain high skill in Intent (Yinian) practice and develop sufficient Internal Qi. It's like electricity. Dantian, three inches below belly button, once developed is like a leather ball. Dantian becomes the place where all Internal Qi of your body gathers, it's like electric field. Then Qi - which is felt as a stream of heat - flows from Hui Yin Point through lumbar vertebra, cervical vertebra, Bai Hui Point (the hot feeling is extremely strong there), Mu Quan Point, Tian Mu Point, Ren Tong Point. The most difficult place for Qi to pass is where Ren and Du Vessels meet - you have to keep the mouth closed and the tongue has to touch upper palate, breathing should be through nose (not like in Long Fist Boxing where after some exercises practitioners have to use mouth to catch the breath); then Qi flows down back to Dantian and completes one full circle - Small Heavenly Circle (Xiao Zhou Tian).

JS: Do you need to use any Intent (Yi) to lead Qi flow?

MR.MA: No, you should not think about Qi when you practice. Small Heavenly Circle will open naturally, not intentionally, when your Neigong reaches this level. However your practice has to be supervised by a competent teacher.

JS: Is it enough to open Small Heavenly Circle?

MR.MA: No, you have to open the Large Heavenly Circle so that Qi can reach your hands. This also takes time and you have to think first - use Intent (Yi) - to drive Qi to the hands. Once Qi follows your Intent, the next step is to be able to move Qi without any conscious effort. The Qi will behave like mercury - once you strike with the hand it immediately flows from out of Dantian, waist, and reaches the hand. The hand will be felt by the opponent as very heavy. Only at this moment you can start learning Bagua techniques and movements.

JS: Does it mean that all Bagua movements are designed in such a way that one must have Neigong first to be really able to use them?

MR.MA: Exactly. Without Neigong all Bagua techniques are good for nothing and there is no use to practice them. For this reason I'm not willing to teach any techniques to students who do not have Internal Skill - it's waste of time for them and me.

JS: I guess very few people can learn in this traditional way?

MR.MA: Yes, practitioners often feel that walking exercise is very boring and give it up after some time. However once your Neigong develops, once the Small Heavenly Circle opens, the practice becomes very interesting.

JS: Did you learn and "Light Skill" (Qing Gong) as well?

MR.MA: Walking in a circle develops "Light Skill". Once you reach a certain level you are able to walk without touching the ground.

JS: How is that possible?

MR.MA: The idea is to use your Dantian, waist, to move. I'm sitting here right now. If you want to attack me I can move fast forward without using legs, but by straightening the waist. (Mr.Ma made a demonstration - from a sitting position he was able to move fast very far forward before he touched the floor with his legs).

JS: It all sounds and looks very mysterious...

MR.MA: It is not mysterious at all, it's just a matter of skill, of hard practice.

JS: Can you use this "Spiraling Power" (Luo Xuan Jin) in fighting?

MR.MA: If the opponent touches any part of your body, this part should express "Spiraling Power". Guo Gumin was famous for his "Raising Palm" (Tiao Zhang), also know as "Hand Thunder" (Zhang Shou Lei) technique. It was based on Spiraling Power used to uproot the opponent upon contact and then hit him which ended with opponent sent flying. Any technique should have this spiraling component inside.
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