Before the action starts?

Ragnar808 · White Belt

Hi, I'm new here and I'm new to karate and a white belt.

I haven't gotten to ask my Shihan about his this yet, but....I'm wondering what people think is the best way to respond to a "basic confrontation".

I know the variables can be 100 fold, but let's just say you're somewhere, there's no one to really help you out and someone bumps you, starts taunting you, threatening you or whatever.

What's a good way to put yourself in position to defend? Stand back 10 feet? Hands up in a non threatening way? Being nice?

I'm just wondering because now that I'm doing karate, I'm often wondering what would I do "right now" if someone messed with me. Should I just run? Act as if I know nothing before I defend? Posture (depending on if I think that'll make someone think twice?)

Thanks for your opinions!

WireFrame · Orange Belt

There are lots of articles and opinions on the internet to do with self defence if you want to do more research, but here is my view and what I've been taught.

Always avoid physical confrontation if possible. If the taunter can be ignored or talked down, do so. Defuse the situation without fighting, and everyone wins.

If physical confrontation is 100% unavoidable, I dont know about standing ten feet away being even possible. I personally wouldn't put my hands up in a way that would leave me vulnerable. There are techniques that look friendly but actually lead to an unexpected attack but at your current level you need to focus on avoiding confrontation (that goes for everyone at any level really) but if it can't be helped, you should focus on what will enable you to get out of the situation.

In the street people don't adhere to dojo rules, and self-defence is very different to training in traditional karate. A lot of the deep stances and straight movements you'll be practicing are brilliant for training and body conditioning, muscle memory, self awareness, strength, speed, reflexes etc. But in a street fight they need to be adapted and used differently so you can make one or two nasty attacks then leg it if possible. I don't think I was getting taught much of that at beginner level, it was all about conditioning for me then.

So long story short: whatever level you reach, always avoid trouble and try to verbally defuse situations.
If it cant be helped, always try and get out of the situation. If you do end up in a fight, go for the weak spots and as soon as they're down do NOT hang around.

[edit]

If you REALLY want to know more about the realistic and nasty situations you can be in and ideas to avoid it, Bas Rutten covers come of the realities of just how dangerous a street fight can be and details you need to pay attention to in that situation.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rQVaTEPOsTA&feature=related

Now I'm NOT recommending every technique he mentions at ALL. You'd get arrested for doing them if your life wasn't in real danger. But what he says about the dangers of what others can do is all true.
Towards the end of that video he mentions distance and where he would have his hands and body posture. If you go to part 2 he talks about drunk angry people. Which is more than likely who you'd have confrontations with in real life. But even Bas Rutten recommends avoiding it if possible.

Ragnar808 · White Belt

Thanks for the lengthy reply!

All very useful info.

I guess what I'm specifically wondering is....if there is such a thing as an "all purpose prepare to defend yourself" position, what would it be? Let's assume that while you're try to talk your way out of it and no one is coming to your aid, that you're going through a set up phase in your mind and body.

I watched the first video and it's certainly a good idea to keep you hands ready to defend and also be aware of what the other person may or may not have in their hands.

algernon · Yellow Belt

There really is no "standard" or "basic" preparation. There are some elements that are fundamental to a good defensive posture; your hands should be available and between you and your attacker, you should keep out of reach, and you should keep your aggressor in sight. Beyond that, the rest is up to the individual and the circumstances.

There were two very videos on the subject posted in "Psychology of a fight." Here they are again.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DdU-dcouUrk
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=shPj5xidsQo

The most important preparation you can make right now is an exit plan. However you posture yourself, make sure that your position gives you an easy escape. As a white belt, your feet are greater assets than your hands, and I am not talking about kicking. The beginning stages of martial arts training are particularly dangerous; you know just enough to get yourself hurt. Hopefully you are learning some very simple movements and strategies that you can employ, but the bulk of your training probably consists of techniques that require some skill to be used effectively. Do not consider using movements that still need a lot of practice; if you cannot perform something well in training, it will certainly not be up to par in real application, and that will only worsen your predicament.

If you feel threatened, get a strategy in your head, but be very mindful of your limitations.

Ragnar808 · White Belt

Thanks again for the reply.

Oh yeah...I'm aware of being a white belt and not being able to do anything. I'm just thinking about things in terms of......before I knew NOTHING really about self defense. Now I know 5% more!

Really just thinking about how to avoid danger and if it comes to me, what may be a good way to prepare. Danger could have come prior to me knowing how to groin kick or do a simple punch or roundhouse kick. Now I know a tiny bit of that and push comes to shove, where before it would have been just fear and I guess hoping to land a punch, now I'm thinking more about how to avoid it and if I can't what's the best way to set myself up for a quick defense

I'm certainly ready to run first, fight second....Run Foo Master!

bushido_man96 · KF Sensei

Having your hands up in a fence position is a good place to start. Stand with a foot slightly back, with your strong side back a bit, if you prefer.

But, you've got a good start with your opening post. Try to difuse, and just get away. No shame in that.
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WireFrame · Orange Belt

If push comes to shove and you're IN a fight, don't rely on fancy kicks. Seriously. Unless it's a swift one to the groin, keep your feet on the ground. It'll keep you more balanced for defending and attacking. If you try a roundhouse or even a front kick, and your opponent catches it, the fight's over. Keep that stuff for competitions and training.

tallgeese · Black Belt

On the topic of posture I'll throw in my two. I'd stay away from it if you can. Flee, or fight the last thing I want is to indicate to the aggressor that I'm prepared.

The only posture you want before attack is the confident and aware one you walk around in. This is far more likely to stem off an attack than anything else.

Once it's go time, simple hands up palms open will to fine. Preferably in a way that looks like a surprise reaction than anything (google "flinch response", it's a good operational theory). This gets your zones covered and preps you mentally (if you've trained around a good core) for the fight.

It should surprise him when you fight back. This only aid you in your efforts. The first idea I want him to have that I'm trained is when I'm applying pain somehow not when we're at a distance.

algernon · Yellow Belt

RichardZ · Brown Belt

The basic action...to deterioriate the situation verbally as possible.

Many confrontations have been won, or stopped before and physical exchange.

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