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White Belt
White Belt

Joined: 21 Dec 2020
Posts: 17

Styles: Shorin Ryu, kickboxing

PostPosted: Thu Dec 31, 2020 2:52 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

i trained at a judo/jiujitsu club where the guy was shodan in judo and japanese jiujitsu and brown in Bjj. his students would win 1st place medals againts all the other BJJ gyms in cali who r ran buy higher ranking belts. he ran a school as a 1st degree BB so I dont see why not if they have the skills and teaching ability to do so; of course it was his own school and he wasn’t affiliated with a gov body but yah... he promoted ranks...
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KF Sensei
KF Sensei

Joined: 31 Mar 2006
Posts: 29027
Location: Hays, KS
Styles: Taekwondo, Combat Hapkido, Aikido, GRACIE

PostPosted: Sat Jan 02, 2021 10:08 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I think in BJJ circles, this tends to work a little differently. I believe there are BJJ blue belts that run schools and promote a few levels, as a BJJ blue belt typically has about as many years in as a typical Karate black belt does.
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KF Sensei
KF Sensei

Joined: 23 Feb 2008
Posts: 15485
Location: Houston, TX
Styles: Shindokan Saitou-ryu [Shuri-te/Okinawa-te based]

PostPosted: Sat Jan 02, 2021 10:43 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

While, for the most, Shodan don't actively promote by themselves; they can sit in on a Testing Cycle but they've no administrative authority. Now, that's the formality of it all.

If I was a Shodan, and I wanted to open my own dojo, with or without, the backing of my Sensei and/or the Governing Body, then by Jiminy Cricket, I'd open my dojo no matter what.

Of course, there'd be backlashes and the such, more than one can even imagine. Without the proper backing, a Shodan would be a Shodan for quite a long time, if not forever.

That Shodan's Student Body would technically be stuck at Shodan themselves with no future rank advancements. Imagine a Shodan promoting ones Student Body beyond Shodan, like Nidan or Sandan, but then remaining a Shodan him/herself.

Now, a Shodan could assemble higher Dan ranks to sit upon the Testing Cycle to administer higher Dan ranks than shodan or Nikyu; with a stamp of approval.

The scenarios would boggle one's imagination.

The worse thing would be the Shodan, as the CI of his/her own dojo, self-promoting themselves to a higher Dan rank, like Godan, or even more alarming to Judan. Integrity would be thrown out with the baby bath water....and this happens at the blink of an eye.

My Sensei would've burned me at the cross if I did that, but if I did that, that's my business and not his. Sure, I'd face the reckoning from a school of upset Senior Dan ranks, starting from my Sensei. It would be an upsetting that might never see the daylight of trust ever again.

But if I did, I'd first link up with a legitimate Senior Dan rank with authority for the order of administrating Testing Cycles from Nikyu and above. However, here's the stick in the bicycle a Shodan, how can I ever teach the necessary materials above Shodan?!?

I'd rather abide by integrity across the board. A Shodan has the authority, however limited; any MAist should never assume a position that they do not possess.


**Proof is on the floor!!!
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Orange Belt
Orange Belt

Joined: 08 Nov 2016
Posts: 197
Location: Denver, CO
Styles: Shuri-Ryu, Uechi-Ryu

PostPosted: Wed Mar 10, 2021 11:13 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

At our dojo (and satellite dojos), no one instructor can promote students. An instructor will inform a student when he is ready for testing, but all testing is done in front of a testing board, which (in typical years) consists of 3 or more dan-level instructors or assistant instructors. Each instructor is responsible for evaluating a group of students -- generally NOT their own students. This is done to keep things above-board and ensure consistency in standards. Kyu testing cycles occur each month.

For dan-level promotions, these are done twice a year after a test prep cycle. They are done in front of a testing board as well, but then the promotion packets are sent to our organization's headquarters, and our organization's head makes the final decisions.

Promotion boards for advanced dan grades (5th and above) are done in person by the head of our organization (James Thompson, 10th degree) and any sufficiently advanced dan practitioners present at the time.
5th kyu Shuri-Ryu, 4th kyu Judo, 2nd kyu Uechi-Ryu
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Red Belt
Red Belt

Joined: 18 Apr 2007
Posts: 827
Location: Formerly Kalispell, Montana, now Spokane, WA
Styles: Shorin Ryu Matsumura Kenpo & Kobudo

PostPosted: Thu May 20, 2021 12:37 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

First of all, this depends on the system you ware in and their rules about this.

From my own personal experience, I was a shodan when my sensei moved to another state (this was in 1979). I was allowed to promote up to 1st kyu because my sensei knew I was a picky bugger and wouldn't promote someone unless they deserved it.

For myself, because of where I lived and with limited resources ($$$'s) to travel to train with higher ranks, I stayed at shodan for 9 YEARS. When I did manage to scrape up the money to travel to train with a 6th dan in Minnesota, he promoted me to nidan, but actually wanted me to skip to sandan because he said I was at that level in his opinion, but didn't feel that was the right thing to do. I was perfectly fine with it. 2 years later I did get to travel again to Seattle and trained with the head of our system, and did get my sandan from him. it was another 8 years before I received my yandan, then I was forced to quit shortly afterwards.

I understand that a beginner wants that coveted black belt, but rank really shouldn't be a goal in the arts. Learning and perfecting is the most important.
If you don't want to stand behind our troops, please..feel free to stand in front of them.

Student since January 1975---4th Dan, retired due to non-martial arts related injuries.
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The Pred
Green Belt
Green Belt

Joined: 26 Jun 2003
Posts: 385

Styles: Goju Ryu

PostPosted: Fri May 21, 2021 7:22 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Yeah I say a 1st or Sbodan can promote people in rank if they stay affiliated with a dojo with a higher rank. By the time their first set of students reach he level before black they will have enough time to potentially have been promoted to 3rd
Teachers are always learning
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