Continuos sparring format vs stop format, for self defence?

Prototype · Green Belt

I don't know how many people have tried both but in Shotokan, you stop after the first technique has been thrown, whether it successfully touched the target or not. This ensures that proper technique will be used. All you need to focus on is a single technique.

In continuos sparring format, like in ITF TaeKwonDo, you can throw 2 punches in succession. After that though you have to either stop or throw a kick, then you can punch again.

Problems with the stop format is lack of realism, and that it's impractical against combinations.

Problems with the continuos format is that punches tend to get watered down and reduced to wild swinging haymakers, with techniques being dilluted.

So for self defence, one sparring format trains you to be precise, but doesn't really prepare you for prolonged interactions. The other does prepare your for prolonged interactions, but only so much.... and the technique aspect goes straight through the window. There is no refinement to what you do. It gets messy.

Which in your experience or opinion is better of the two for self defence?

mushybees · Orange Belt

For me I find short rounds of continuous sparring is best. If it does on too long it can get sloppy.

We sometimes do 60 second rounds which I find are great. We rotate partners after each round.
It forces engagement and a sense of urgency.

If we only did that I'd find it lacking but we mix it up frequently.

In terms of "self defence" we have in the past had one person act as the initial aggressor who pushes, grabs and/or strikes.
There's no de-escalation or environment awareness training so only the physical aspect of sd.
That's always a bit of fun and can be useful

DWx · Black Belt

I think it depends and both can be beneficial.

Point-fighting makes you very fast and maybe best reflects ikken hitssatsu. But a real fight might mean a bit of back and forth and having to use more than one attack to take your opponent down.

(also re. ITF Taekwon-Do, depends on which ITF. Only one group implements the 2-punch rule for competition. Should really train continuous sparring with strikes and punches anyway if you're true to the style and don't train just for comps).
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Prototype · Green Belt

TJ-Jitsu · Blue Belt

That's always been the mentality of karate and the eastern style arts though- one punch one kill, hence the point sparring.
Continuous sparring is better because its more realistic. The fact that people end up with wild swinging haymakers and untechnical punches is their fault- not the sparring format...

Ultimately you want to graduate to just "sparring" like a simple boxing/thai boxing setup where its continuous and the power is a little greater.

DWx · Black Belt

GojuRyu Bahrain · Orange Belt

Prototype · Green Belt

MatsuShinshii · Black Belt

I think the problem is the stopping.

It's not realistic no matter the reason it is practiced. This will ingrain muscle memory and as such the student will respond this way in real life.

As far as two punches and stop or kick to throw more. I'm not sure about this or why this would be practiced either. In real life there are no rules that state after so many of these techniques you must stop or throw a kick. Real life is unpredictable and as such the student must use the right responses for any given sequence of attacks. Stopping or needing to throw a kick at the wrong time and you're looking up at the ceiling wondering how you got there.

"Self defense" applications are practiced at a beginner level at a slow pace so that the students can develop the proper body mechanics and learn the technique. The problem with some schools is that they never ramp this up and make it real. What good is found in practicing against a partner that allows you to do as you will? If the threat of a continued attack is not present we can all look like king Karate.

This exercise is meant to be done with a compliant partner at first but the speed and power is increased and the compliance is eventually discarded to that there is realism. Full speed, full power, non-compliance and intent to connect. Without this the student is learning nothing and even worse building muscle memory so that when they are attacked this will be their response and they will be destroyed.
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The person who succeeds is not the one who holds back, fearing failure, nor the one who never fails-but the one who moves on in spite of failure.
Charles R. Swindoll

DWx · Black Belt

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