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Alan Armstrong
Black Belt
Black Belt

Joined: 28 Feb 2016
Posts: 2165


PostPosted: Fri Jan 05, 2018 4:26 am    Post subject: Courage & Bravery Reply with quote

Medals are given out for being brave and courageous.

Are there strategies to help become more valiant or is it just something that some are born with and others are not?

Martial arts is a known way to build more confidence in people but does this apply to also being courageous?

Is courage something we build up in oneself and then use it when need be?

It takes courage to admit to oneself of being wrong and it is a brave person that can admit to it openly.

(Brave and courageous people such as firefighters, police, medical, and milatary personnel, and all those that fight for the well being and safety of others should be constantly thanked, congratulated and appreciated on their efforts)

Can we go beyond confidence building as martial artists, aiming higher with strategies and tactics that can make a difference?
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singularity6
Pre-Black Belt
Pre-Black Belt

Joined: 26 Jun 2017
Posts: 958
Location: Michigan
Styles: Jidokwan Taekwondo and Hapkido, Yoshokai Aikido, ZNIR Iaido, Kendo

PostPosted: Fri Jan 05, 2018 9:54 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I think this depends largely on individuals. Some folks are willing, even eager, to take on hazardous challenges. Others are not. While there is quite a bit of mental training that goes into martial arts, it seems like a big portion of that is focused toward reacting to situations where your physical well-being is being threatened by another individual or group of people. The training will help you react with little or no thought.

Running into a fire is an entirely different scenario; it requires a different mindset, and different training. The same could be said for performing a challenging/risky medical procedure.

While on this topic: One thing that irks me is that folks here in the US seem to think we need to constantly praise police and military personal. While I'm not opposed to recognizing individuals and groups for jobs well-done, and brave service, I do find it quite annoying that teachers get ignored, and even chastised. Teachers, in their own way are also brave and courageous. They too should be recognized.
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sensei8
KF Sensei
KF Sensei

Joined: 23 Feb 2008
Posts: 14370
Location: Houston, TX
Styles: Shindokan Saitou-ryu [Shuri-te/Okinawa-te based]

PostPosted: Fri Jan 05, 2018 10:47 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I believe that if ones not born with either of them, they can be learned, but in time.

However, in order to learn, one will have to be born with the special totality, and/or they've been raised by parents who already possess those characteristics, in which they then pass those abilities to their children by how they raise them.

Nonetheless, not everyone can or wants to learn those characteristics for their own reasons.Fight or flight!! Pick one!! Oftentimes, and that varies in individuals, those characteristics already exist. Just takes the right person and the right situations to bring them to bare.




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DWx
KF Sensei
KF Sensei

Joined: 17 Jan 2007
Posts: 6140
Location: UK
Styles: Tae Kwon Do & Yang family Tai Chi

PostPosted: Fri Jan 05, 2018 1:34 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

sensei8 wrote:
I believe that if ones not born with either of them, they can be learned, but in time.

I'd agree with this. We always talk about martial arts giving people confidence and I think it can inspire people to be more courageous too. Challenge themselves and overcome fears.

But let's not confuse courage and bravery with recklessness. Yes courage and bravery can mean you're willing to put yourself in positions others won't, but it shouldn't be needlessly reckless.

singularity6 wrote:

While on this topic: One thing that irks me is that folks here in the US seem to think we need to constantly praise police and military personal. While I'm not opposed to recognizing individuals and groups for jobs well-done, and brave service, I do find it quite annoying that teachers get ignored, and even chastised. Teachers, in their own way are also brave and courageous. They too should be recognized.

I totally agree about thanking teachers and others. I always feel doctors nurses and other health workers deserve way more credit then they get. Especially those on the front line like paramedics or in the ER or ICU.
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MatsuShinshii
Black Belt
Black Belt

Joined: 15 Aug 2016
Posts: 1423
Location: Kentucky
Styles: Machimura Suidi Rokudan, Ryukyu Kenpo, Kobudo, Judo

PostPosted: Fri Jan 05, 2018 5:31 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I view these two traits differently.

I think of brave being someone that does not fear and therefor they are brave. Bravery IMHO is something you are born with. Basically absence of fear.

Courage on the other hand is someone that is afraid but do to conviction puts that aside and does what is necessary despite the fear. IMHO this is not a trait that you are born with rather it is a conscious decision despite what your common sense tells you. You choose to do what your brain tells you is a bad idea for the good of others.

I have known both types in my life time. I hold the courageous in higher regard and have the utmost respect for them. These are the individuals that fight to save others or charge the hill to save their brothers in arms. True Heroes.

Martial arts does build confidence and could lead to courage with the inclusion of moral conviction. To put others above yourself.
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singularity6
Pre-Black Belt
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Joined: 26 Jun 2017
Posts: 958
Location: Michigan
Styles: Jidokwan Taekwondo and Hapkido, Yoshokai Aikido, ZNIR Iaido, Kendo

PostPosted: Sat Jan 06, 2018 10:19 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

DWx wrote:
sensei8 wrote:
I believe that if ones not born with either of them, they can be learned, but in time.

I'd agree with this. We always talk about martial arts giving people confidence and I think it can inspire people to be more courageous too. Challenge themselves and overcome fears.

But let's not confuse courage and bravery with recklessness. Yes courage and bravery can mean you're willing to put yourself in positions others won't, but it shouldn't be needlessly reckless.

singularity6 wrote:

While on this topic: One thing that irks me is that folks here in the US seem to think we need to constantly praise police and military personal. While I'm not opposed to recognizing individuals and groups for jobs well-done, and brave service, I do find it quite annoying that teachers get ignored, and even chastised. Teachers, in their own way are also brave and courageous. They too should be recognized.

I totally agree about thanking teachers and others. I always feel doctors nurses and other health workers deserve way more credit then they get. Especially those on the front line like paramedics or in the ER or ICU.


Indeed!
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LLLEARNER
Brown Belt
Brown Belt

Joined: 10 Feb 2016
Posts: 687
Location: Central Maine

PostPosted: Sat Jan 06, 2018 10:42 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

singularity6 wrote:

While on this topic: One thing that irks me is that folks here in the US seem to think we need to constantly praise police and military personal. While I'm not opposed to recognizing individuals and groups for jobs well-done, and brave service, I do find it quite annoying that teachers get ignored, and even chastised. Teachers, in their own way are also brave and courageous. They too should be recognized.


Especially in some rough schools. Those places are more like warzones that schools.
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"Walk a single path, becoming neither cocky with victory nor broken with defeat, without forgetting caution when all is quiet or becoming frightened when danger threatens." ~ Jigaro Kano
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Fat Cobra
Orange Belt
Orange Belt

Joined: 14 Jul 2018
Posts: 160
Location: Fort Drum, NY
Styles: Ryukyu Kempo

PostPosted: Wed Aug 15, 2018 6:49 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

MatsuShinshii wrote:
I view these two traits differently.

I think of brave being someone that does not fear and therefor they are brave. Bravery IMHO is something you are born with. Basically absence of fear.

Courage on the other hand is someone that is afraid but do to conviction puts that aside and does what is necessary despite the fear. IMHO this is not a trait that you are born with rather it is a conscious decision despite what your common sense tells you. You choose to do what your brain tells you is a bad idea for the good of others.

I have known both types in my life time. I hold the courageous in higher regard and have the utmost respect for them. These are the individuals that fight to save others or charge the hill to save their brothers in arms. True Heroes.

Martial arts does build confidence and could lead to courage with the
inclusion of moral conviction. To put others above yourself.


MatsuShinshii, I agree with your distinction between the two. Some people are predisposed from birth to be braver than others. It is a character trait, much like some are born faster, or stronger, or more intelligent, etc.

However, courage is something you can build in yourself and train to make yourself better. The best way to do this is to constantly put yourself out of your comfort zone. Do things that make you uncomfortable so that, once you accomplish the task, you realize you can succeed in this type of environment.
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OneKickWonder
Purple Belt
Purple Belt

Joined: 17 Feb 2018
Posts: 513

Styles: Tang soo do

PostPosted: Wed Aug 15, 2018 7:42 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Fat Cobra wrote:
MatsuShinshii wrote:
I view these two traits differently.

I think of brave being someone that does not fear and therefor they are brave. Bravery IMHO is something you are born with. Basically absence of fear.

Courage on the other hand is someone that is afraid but do to conviction puts that aside and does what is necessary despite the fear. IMHO this is not a trait that you are born with rather it is a conscious decision despite what your common sense tells you. You choose to do what your brain tells you is a bad idea for the good of others.

I have known both types in my life time. I hold the courageous in higher regard and have the utmost respect for them. These are the individuals that fight to save others or charge the hill to save their brothers in arms. True Heroes.

Martial arts does build confidence and could lead to courage with the
inclusion of moral conviction. To put others above yourself.


MatsuShinshii, I agree with your distinction between the two. Some people are predisposed from birth to be braver than others. It is a character trait, much like some are born faster, or stronger, or more intelligent, etc.

However, courage is something you can build in yourself and train to make yourself better. The best way to do this is to constantly put yourself out of your comfort zone. Do things that make you uncomfortable so that, once you accomplish the task, you realize you can succeed in this type of environment.


Bravery is naivety. It is the ability to do something that blind faith alone has you believe possible. Youngsters tend to be brave, because they foolishly believe they are indestructible. Older folks are often less brave because they've seen or felt enough consequences over the years to know better.

Courage is different. Courage is the determination to do what you perceive to be necessary no matter what.

I agree on the point about put yourself outside of your comfort zone. Incidentally this is also how one tackles issues like phobias and anxiety.
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MatsuShinshii
Black Belt
Black Belt

Joined: 15 Aug 2016
Posts: 1423
Location: Kentucky
Styles: Machimura Suidi Rokudan, Ryukyu Kenpo, Kobudo, Judo

PostPosted: Wed Aug 15, 2018 3:09 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Fat Cobra wrote:
MatsuShinshii wrote:
I view these two traits differently.

I think of brave being someone that does not fear and therefor they are brave. Bravery IMHO is something you are born with. Basically absence of fear.

Courage on the other hand is someone that is afraid but do to conviction puts that aside and does what is necessary despite the fear. IMHO this is not a trait that you are born with rather it is a conscious decision despite what your common sense tells you. You choose to do what your brain tells you is a bad idea for the good of others.

I have known both types in my life time. I hold the courageous in higher regard and have the utmost respect for them. These are the individuals that fight to save others or charge the hill to save their brothers in arms. True Heroes.

Martial arts does build confidence and could lead to courage with the
inclusion of moral conviction. To put others above yourself.


MatsuShinshii, I agree with your distinction between the two. Some people are predisposed from birth to be braver than others. It is a character trait, much like some are born faster, or stronger, or more intelligent, etc.

However, courage is something you can build in yourself and train to make yourself better. The best way to do this is to constantly put yourself out of your comfort zone. Do things that make you uncomfortable so that, once you accomplish the task, you realize you can succeed in this type of environment.


There are many forms of courage. I guess I was mainly speaking of the courage it takes to defy your own fear, common sense and self preservation for others. Basically - to lay down ones life, if necessary, to save others.

And even though this could be skewed towards the Military (which would be 100% true) this also extends to the fireman, the policeman, the strange on the streets that stops to help another stranger because it's the right thing to do, those that would make that snap decision, throw away common sense and rush to the aid of others no matter what their occupation or predisposition is in life.

Courage is fighting every fiber in your body telling you not to do something but based on your convictions, you push the fear back and do it anyway.

I have known many brave people in my life and have had the honor to know a few courageous people in my life. Believe me there is a huge and distinct difference between the two.
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