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OneKickWonder
Purple Belt
Purple Belt

Joined: 17 Feb 2018
Posts: 513

Styles: Tang soo do

PostPosted: Sat Feb 24, 2018 7:23 pm    Post subject: Defence of others Reply with quote

There's no shortage of discussion and tuition of self defence.

But as a husband and a dad, I sometimes take the format of 'do this to enable your escape' or the 'best aware of your surroundings and avoid threat' scenarios with a big pinch of salt.

I'm middle age man. Slightly overweight. Fit for my age but nothing against 2 or 3 people on their late teens or early 20s. And I usually have my wife and 2 young kids with me. Stun and escape is something that means little to me.

So I wonder, who else thinks about having to intervene/intercepte? And what general principles do people think about in this regard?
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sensei8
KF Sensei
KF Sensei

Joined: 23 Feb 2008
Posts: 14405
Location: Houston, TX
Styles: Shindokan Saitou-ryu [Shuri-te/Okinawa-te based]

PostPosted: Sat Feb 24, 2018 11:27 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Coming to the aide of a stranger HAS TO BE in that person somehow and someway. If that individual has that inside of them, then that person will intervene to the best of their abilities.

Just because a MAist might have the necessary skill set to intervene, not many MAist will!!

Ever seen that tv series, What Would You Do?, hosted by John Quinones?? The majority will NOT intervene, if they can avoid it for whatever their reasons might or might not be.

I've seen black belt's turn away because they've not that type of knowledge and experience within themselves to intervene. They want to, but then they don't!! Wanting is one thing, but actually doing something is a worlds apart.

I was raised to intervene...I was trained to intervene...I once worked as a bouncer in my early 20's at a strip club, therefore, it's within me to intervene to help those that I believe aren't able to.

Self esteem, imho, and the lack of it will therefore choke the will to intervene out of a person quite immediately. Being attacked is one thing, but intervening for someone else, brings a whole bunch of concerns, mostly unnervingly to deal with at the wrong time.



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OneKickWonder
Purple Belt
Purple Belt

Joined: 17 Feb 2018
Posts: 513

Styles: Tang soo do

PostPosted: Sun Feb 25, 2018 7:10 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thanks, but I didn't mean about defending a stranger. I meant defending my wife or kids should the need arise.
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singularity6
Pre-Black Belt
Pre-Black Belt

Joined: 26 Jun 2017
Posts: 958
Location: Michigan
Styles: Jidokwan Taekwondo and Hapkido, Yoshokai Aikido, ZNIR Iaido, Kendo

PostPosted: Sun Feb 25, 2018 8:36 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

sensei8 wrote:
Coming to the aide of a stranger HAS TO BE in that person somehow and someway. If that individual has that inside of them, then that person will intervene to the best of their abilities.

Just because a MAist might have the necessary skill set to intervene, not many MAist will!!

Ever seen that tv series, What Would You Do?, hosted by John Quinones?? The majority will NOT intervene, if they can avoid it for whatever their reasons might or might not be.

I've seen black belt's turn away because they've not that type of knowledge and experience within themselves to intervene. They want to, but then they don't!! Wanting is one thing, but actually doing something is a worlds apart.

I was raised to intervene...I was trained to intervene...I once worked as a bouncer in my early 20's at a strip club, therefore, it's within me to intervene to help those that I believe aren't able to.

Self esteem, imho, and the lack of it will therefore choke the will to intervene out of a person quite immediately. Being attacked is one thing, but intervening for someone else, brings a whole bunch of concerns, mostly unnervingly to deal with at the wrong time.




Heh, my brother was a bartender at a strip club for a while. Because of his stature and training (an accomplished wrestler,) he was also in charge of escorting the rowdy clients out.
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singularity6
Pre-Black Belt
Pre-Black Belt

Joined: 26 Jun 2017
Posts: 958
Location: Michigan
Styles: Jidokwan Taekwondo and Hapkido, Yoshokai Aikido, ZNIR Iaido, Kendo

PostPosted: Sun Feb 25, 2018 8:39 am    Post subject: Re: Defence of others Reply with quote

OneKickWonder wrote:
There's no shortage of discussion and tuition of self defence.

But as a husband and a dad, I sometimes take the format of 'do this to enable your escape' or the 'best aware of your surroundings and avoid threat' scenarios with a big pinch of salt.

I'm middle age man. Slightly overweight. Fit for my age but nothing against 2 or 3 people on their late teens or early 20s. And I usually have my wife and 2 young kids with me. Stun and escape is something that means little to me.

So I wonder, who else thinks about having to intervene/intercepte? And what general principles do people think about in this regard?


It's not glamorous or even "insightful," but "do what you gotta do" comes to mind.
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LLLEARNER
Brown Belt
Brown Belt

Joined: 10 Feb 2016
Posts: 687
Location: Central Maine

PostPosted: Sun Feb 25, 2018 3:22 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Defending your family should be something every parent thinks about occasionally. A couple times I have come home at midnight and found doors open. The first time the dog had opened the sliding door and let himself out after they had gone to bed. The second time a garage door had been left open.
Guess what I did.
I also know where the fatal funnels and opportunities for crossfire/ambush are in the house. Fortunately, it is a small house with a simple design. Where I live I also concern myself with wayward wildlife.

If I am in public with my 6 year old daughter I tend to rely on being aware of the surroundings and am a big fan of the early exit.

If I am by myself or with other adults, I will intervene.
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"Those who know don't talk. Those who talk don't know." ~ Lao-tzu, Tao Te Ching

"Walk a single path, becoming neither cocky with victory nor broken with defeat, without forgetting caution when all is quiet or becoming frightened when danger threatens." ~ Jigaro Kano
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OneKickWonder
Purple Belt
Purple Belt

Joined: 17 Feb 2018
Posts: 513

Styles: Tang soo do

PostPosted: Sun Feb 25, 2018 3:54 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I'm thinking that in tang soo do (my current main style), as well as in previous styles I've trained in, most of the training kind of follows the format of, when YOU are attacked, do this.

So most of the training is geared towards dealing with positioning and such for an assailant that is focused on you.

To defend another, one has to attack. Of course there are plenty of techniques that can be used offensively, but I feel that our training perhaps doesn't really prepare us for that. At this point, it's just primal instinct rather than training I think.

But then surely we must think about how our actions will affect the person we are protecting. For example, let's say in a street robbery scenario, a thug places a blade near the wife's face. If we make a grab or try to kick the assailant, will we knock is balance such that he cuts the wife unintentionally? Or in a more active confrontation, what if out intervention by kick or punch accidentally catches the very person we're trying to protect?

These are purely hypothetical scenarios of course. I just wonder if others think these things through from time to time, and what general ideas are out there.
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sensei8
KF Sensei
KF Sensei

Joined: 23 Feb 2008
Posts: 14405
Location: Houston, TX
Styles: Shindokan Saitou-ryu [Shuri-te/Okinawa-te based]

PostPosted: Sun Feb 25, 2018 4:32 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

OneKickWonder wrote:
Thanks, but I didn't mean about defending a stranger. I meant defending my wife or kids should the need arise.

If I am willing, as well as not shy, in defending strangers, imagine just how much more I am willing to do anything and everything when it comes to protecting my wife and/or kids with unmitigated resolve!!

Fatality outcomes are always a possibility, and that's not what I want to happen, however, when it comes to my wife and/or kids, then let it me so with cause!!



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OneKickWonder
Purple Belt
Purple Belt

Joined: 17 Feb 2018
Posts: 513

Styles: Tang soo do

PostPosted: Sun Feb 25, 2018 5:05 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

sensei8 wrote:
OneKickWonder wrote:
Thanks, but I didn't mean about defending a stranger. I meant defending my wife or kids should the need arise.

If I am willing, as well as not shy, in defending strangers, imagine just how much more I am willing to do anything and everything when it comes to protecting my wife and/or kids with unmitigated resolve!!

Fatality outcomes are always a possibility, and that's not what I want to happen, however, when it comes to my wife and/or kids, then let it me so with cause!!




A perfectly natural and understandable emotional thought there. But what about practical ideas?
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sensei8
KF Sensei
KF Sensei

Joined: 23 Feb 2008
Posts: 14405
Location: Houston, TX
Styles: Shindokan Saitou-ryu [Shuri-te/Okinawa-te based]

PostPosted: Sun Feb 25, 2018 10:18 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

OneKickWonder wrote:
sensei8 wrote:
OneKickWonder wrote:
Thanks, but I didn't mean about defending a stranger. I meant defending my wife or kids should the need arise.

If I am willing, as well as not shy, in defending strangers, imagine just how much more I am willing to do anything and everything when it comes to protecting my wife and/or kids with unmitigated resolve!!

Fatality outcomes are always a possibility, and that's not what I want to happen, however, when it comes to my wife and/or kids, then let it me so with cause!!




A perfectly natural and understandable emotional thought there. But what about practical ideas?

Just what about practical ideas??

Attack my wife and/or kids, and if necessary, I'll demonstrate practical ideas to the Nth degree. If I can defuse the situation without being physical, then I will. However, if I feel that physicality will be necessary, then so be it.

Keeping my wife and/or kids separate from harm is my job. Keeping us together...staying in well light areas...not going into well known unsafe areas...ushering them away from potential situations immediately...using common sense, and not being irresponsible...paying attention to signals...etc!!

My Dai-Soke taught us to escape from danger as fast as possible without haste. But if we can't, then defend ourselves/family with whatever one has to, with cause. There's no shame in running, if one can!!



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