Add KarateForums.com
Username:    Password:
Remember Me?    
   I Lost My Password!
Post new topic   Reply to topic    KarateForums.com Forum Index -> Instructor Central
 See a User Guidelines violation? Press on the post.
Author Message

DWx
KF Sensei
KF Sensei

Joined: 17 Jan 2007
Posts: 6186
Location: UK
Styles: Tae Kwon Do & Yang family Tai Chi

PostPosted: Thu Oct 24, 2019 2:23 pm    Post subject: Do you teach Strength & Conditioning in your dojo? Reply with quote

The vast majority of Martial Arts lessons incorporate callisthenics, push-ups, sit ups etc. Does anyone incorporate strength and conditioning into their classes? By that I mean weighted exercises using dumbells, barbells etc., muscle activation or plyogility drills?
_________________
"Everything has its beauty, but not everyone sees it." ~ Confucius
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message

Alan Armstrong
Black Belt
Black Belt

Joined: 28 Feb 2016
Posts: 2412


PostPosted: Thu Oct 24, 2019 5:18 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Lack of strength is not an issue with those I teach, as they being adults already having martial art experience and plenty of strength.

Once the strength equally matches techniques, then increase the strength by all means but relying on strength to compensate for technique is not advisable.

Using the strength they have and working with it, developing effectiveness is the challenge, usually trying to balance them out with Yin concepts, of relaxing, yielding, sinking, deflecting and proprioception.

Therefore understanding energy is important, body mechanics, balance, momentum, different martial art engines, taking and making every movement and turning them in to an advantage if possible,

Conditioning is usually down to each individual as some are more advanced than others.

I do require students to take up, the way of the stick, this is a very important ingredient in conditioning and coordinating movements properly, as they translate well in to empty hand combat, such as striking areas and reference points that work well for judging distance, among many other important factor, in conditioning articulations, such as the neck, shoulders, elbows wrists, hips, knees and ankles.

I am fanatical about (core muscle) conditioning (Bruce Lee level) it doesn't take long to understand why it is important to be conditioning oneself.

As being dynamic requires it, with whipping and propelling the body fast can very easily pinch nerves, jolt joints and tear muscles if not properly warmed up and conditioned to do so.

Teaching agility just for the sake of it is not productive, moving strategies are, strategic stepping, flanking manouevres, intercepting jamming techniques, attacking the opponent's balance and using speed and timing correctly.

Conditioning stamina and intestinal fortitude need an honourable mention here.

Hope this is all useful information regarding strength and conditioning.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail

bushido_man96
KF Sensei
KF Sensei

Joined: 31 Mar 2006
Posts: 27927
Location: Hays, KS
Styles: Taekwondo, Combat Hapkido, Aikido, GRACIE

PostPosted: Thu Oct 24, 2019 7:44 pm    Post subject: Re: Do you teach Strength & Conditioning in your dojo? Reply with quote

DWx wrote:
The vast majority of Martial Arts lessons incorporate callisthenics, push-ups, sit ups etc. Does anyone incorporate strength and conditioning into their classes? By that I mean weighted exercises using dumbells, barbells etc., muscle activation or plyogility drills?


Personally, I would not recommend doing so. I would recommend students that want to get stronger do so by seeking out a dedicated strength training program, and putting in the work on the side to get stronger. What you will be able to accomplish with dumbells and the minimal amount of time you'd be able to dedicate your classes to will not amount to much of an overall strength gain in the long run, and the time spent in class would be better spent dedicated to practicing TKD.

I recently posted a thread in the Health, Training, and Fitness forum in regards to this approach: https://www.karateforums.com/the-two-factor-model-of-sports-and-ma-performance-vt52769.html

As for conditioning, it would probably be most beneficial to work that into the drills in the TKD classes, using timed drills and the like along with sparring. Round-robin sparring is a great way to work in conditioning.[/url]
_________________
www.haysgym.com
http://www.sunyis.com/
www.aikidoofnorthwestkansas.com
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail

Fat Cobra
Orange Belt
Orange Belt

Joined: 14 Jul 2018
Posts: 200
Location: Fort Drum, NY
Styles: Ryukyu Kempo

PostPosted: Fri Oct 25, 2019 6:08 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

We do strength training on occasion, but it is functional strength training. I highly encourage my students to conduct strength training as well outside of the dojo, especially grip strength training.

Some examples of what we do are lunges with heavy chains around the neck, Turkish Get-Ups with Kettle Bells, and Subari Exercises for grip strength.
_________________
Sandan in Ryukyu Kempo
Head of the Shubu Kan in Fort Drum, NY
(United Ryukyu Kempo Alliance)
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message

sensei8
KF Sensei
KF Sensei

Joined: 23 Feb 2008
Posts: 14609
Location: Houston, TX
Styles: Shindokan Saitou-ryu [Shuri-te/Okinawa-te based]

PostPosted: Fri Oct 25, 2019 3:18 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

As you describe in your OP, as part of the curriculum?? No, sorry. My students can do things like that on their own, if they feel a need to do so, and I'll help them if they've any questions along those lines.



_________________
**Proof is on the floor!!!
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail

Alan Armstrong
Black Belt
Black Belt

Joined: 28 Feb 2016
Posts: 2412


PostPosted: Sat Oct 26, 2019 5:43 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I believe that it is important for students to understand some simple realities that is, without strengthening the heart and lungs, the longer or intense the fight, it could come down to which person can hold out the longest, endurance.

Perhaps when we talk about strength and conditioning, it is about becoming physically stronger and being able to give out and take punishment.

However strengthening the heart and lungs are important organs to develop.

Both are be very beneficial in a fight especially when under stress with heavier breathing and when the heart is pounding.

Conditioning the heart and lungs to make them bigger for endurance and developing a stronger heart for strength.

When talking about strengthing and conditioning without developing the heart and lungs, is like looking at a car that looks like it can move and perform very fast, without considering the performance of the engine.

Which is what developing chi in the body is about, heart and lungs and the flow of efficient energy around the body.

This aspect has nothing to do with fighting but has everything to do with staying in the the fight for as long as it takes.

As having four heart attacks and being an x smoker, I am knowledgeable and experienced enough to say that..

At the very centre of conditioning should be the heart and lungs.

This is why Chi is called vital breath and that Chi cannot be separated from blood which is pumped around the body due to the heart.

Breath and Blood, something to consider when training to be stronger and conditioned.

Considered being the best exercise for the heart and lungs is staircase climbing.

Thanks for reading
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail

DWx
KF Sensei
KF Sensei

Joined: 17 Jan 2007
Posts: 6186
Location: UK
Styles: Tae Kwon Do & Yang family Tai Chi

PostPosted: Sun Oct 27, 2019 3:02 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I have to admit I didn't expect such a strong negative response to this.

Do you practice hojo undo? (or dallyon in Korean?)

I see S&C training as a modern extension of this and whilst the majority of this work should be done outside of class time, its still my job to teach students about it.
_________________
"Everything has its beauty, but not everyone sees it." ~ Confucius
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message

Alan Armstrong
Black Belt
Black Belt

Joined: 28 Feb 2016
Posts: 2412


PostPosted: Sun Oct 27, 2019 6:15 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

DWx wrote:
I have to admit I didn't expect such a strong negative response to this.

Do you practice hojo undo? (or dallyon in Korean?)

I see S&C training as a modern extension of this and whilst the majority of this work should be done outside of class time, its still my job to teach students about it.
Some ideas:

Personally my hojo undo, hand conditioning, "chin na" is mainly with catching weighted sand bags or tennis balls, way of the stick, dumb bells and just resentlly the monkey bars...
https://youtu.be/yN8ji7tq66A

Circuit Training & High Intensity Interval Training.
Focusing on or Incorporating:

Strength

Power

Cardio

Endurance

Core Strength

Flexibility

Mobility

Agility

Speed

Balance

Timing

Proprioception

Suggest to make circuit/s routines that fit your needs, have fun train hard.

Heart and lungs work together
https://youtu.be/O8ttt3M8qZM

Remember, to practice fight breathing techniques while training.
https://youtu.be/kdLCzIY568g

With over 600 muscles in the human body the heart is the most important; work it!

What else you can do for the most important muscle in your body
https://youtu.be/wSefvGaYTfo
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail

sensei8
KF Sensei
KF Sensei

Joined: 23 Feb 2008
Posts: 14609
Location: Houston, TX
Styles: Shindokan Saitou-ryu [Shuri-te/Okinawa-te based]

PostPosted: Sun Oct 27, 2019 8:19 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

DWx wrote:
I have to admit I didn't expect such a strong negative response to this.

Do you practice hojo undo? (or dallyon in Korean?)

I see S&C training as a modern extension of this and whilst the majority of this work should be done outside of class time, its still my job to teach students about it.

Yes, we practice Hojo Undo regularly as it's intertwined with practically everything that we do.



_________________
**Proof is on the floor!!!
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail

bushido_man96
KF Sensei
KF Sensei

Joined: 31 Mar 2006
Posts: 27927
Location: Hays, KS
Styles: Taekwondo, Combat Hapkido, Aikido, GRACIE

PostPosted: Mon Oct 28, 2019 11:30 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

DWx wrote:
I have to admit I didn't expect such a strong negative response to this.

Do you practice hojo undo? (or dallyon in Korean?)

I see S&C training as a modern extension of this and whilst the majority of this work should be done outside of class time, its still my job to teach students about it.


My question would be how much of your class time are you willing to dedicate to this kind of training, to the detriment of actual TKD-focused training? And what does the training incorporate? And to that end, how much true "strength" gets developed from that training?

In the end, the way I view it, is if it's worth the class time spent doing it for the actual benefit that results, or is there a better, more efficient alternative to actually building strength?
_________________
www.haysgym.com
http://www.sunyis.com/
www.aikidoofnorthwestkansas.com
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail
Display posts from previous:   
Post new topic   Reply to topic    KarateForums.com Forum Index -> Instructor Central All times are GMT - 6 Hours
Page 1 of 1
Jump to:  
You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum


< Advertising - Contact - Disclosure Policy - Staff - User Guidelines >