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Wastelander
KF Sensei
KF Sensei

Joined: 18 Oct 2010
Posts: 2723
Location: Phoenix, AZ
Styles: Shorin-Ryu, Shuri-Ryu, Judo, KishimotoDi

PostPosted: Tue Feb 14, 2023 11:23 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

bushido_man96 wrote:
Wastelander wrote:
bushido_man96 wrote:
Wastelander wrote:
Well, the Shorinkan has 10 dan ranks, although I'm not with the organization anymore. The Bugeikan doesn't have dan ranks for KishimotoDi, at all--just a Shihan license you can test for, eventually. For my own school, once COVID settles down, I think I'm going to get rid of the multiple levels of yudansha, entirely. The closest I would have is a "curriculum black belt" and an "instructor black belt."


What do you mean by "curriculum black belt" and "instructor black belt?"


It's a good thing this post got brought back to life--I completely missed this question! I actually ended up tweaking this, a bit, but the idea was to have a black belt rank for those who learn all of the adult curriculum that I established as being required, and another black belt rank for those who want to be instructors, which would require them to ALSO know the youth curriculum, as well as the Bugeikan material, so that they were equipped to teach everything that I teach. I ended up just going with one black belt rank, and a Shidoin certificate for those who learn the rest of the material and want to teach.


I see what you mean here. What you are suggesting sounds like a separate instructor certification.



That's exactly what I ended up with, yes. After thinking it over, a separate belt didn't really make sense to me, since it just amounted to a certification, anyway

R5ky wrote:
Quote:
but the idea was to have a black belt rank for those who learn all of the adult curriculum that I established as being required, and another black belt rank for those who want to be instructors, which would require them to ALSO know the youth curriculum, as well as the Bugeikan material, so that they were equipped to teach everything that I teach. I ended up just going with one black belt rank, and a Shidoin certificate for those who learn the rest of the material and want to teach.


That's an intriguing concept; how long would one have to train before becoming a candidate for black belt? What are the distinctions between youth and adult curriculum?


To be a candidate for black belt, you must be at least 18 years old, and with the time-in-grade requirements, it comes out to around 8 years of active training time, and 100 teaching/assisting hours, because I consider teaching to be a valuable learning experience, even if you aren't planning to teach. Those looking to go for the instructor certificate have to put in 150 hours of teaching/assisting time. The adult curriculum runs through the three Kihongata created by Chibana, then the three Shorin-Ryu Naihanchi kata, Tawada Passai, and Kusanku Dai. For black belt, they then need to learn Shuri Sanchin, then select either Chinto, Gojushiho, or Seiyunchin to learn from me, as well as going out and learning a kata from another system, and making a kata of their own. Of course, application goes with all of the kata.

The youth curriculum isn't vastly different from the adult curriculum, except in how it is broken down, and the fact that it goes through the first three Pinan kata (with the last two optional) before getting to Naihanchi, while the adult curriculum starts with Naihanchi and doesn't use the Pinan kata. This would mean that an instructor candidate would need to learn all 5 Pinan kata, and associated application--much of which can be found in Passai, Kusanku, and Chinto, so it won't be new, but they'll need to be able to attribute it appropriately. Ideally, they'd also pick up all three of the "optional" kata for black belts. The Bugeikan material consists of Shuri Sanchin--which I already require for black belt--and the four KishimotoDi kata, which are Tachimura no Naihanchi, Nidanbu, Tachimura no Passai, and Tachimura no Kusanku. It's a LOT of material, and that's honestly pared down from what I personally know. A total of 23 kata, if you count the Kihongata as kata (not everyone does), with application, for the instructor certification, compared to just 12 for black belt--four more than I needed to know for my own black belt test, but 10 less than I actually knew at the time
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Kishimoto-Di | 2014-Present | Sensei: Ulf Karlsson
Shorin-Ryu/Neoclassical Karate | 2010-Present: Yondan, Renshi | Sensei: Richard Poage (RIP), Jeff Allred (RIP)
Shuri-Ryu | 2006-2010: Sankyu | Sensei: Joey Johnston, Joe Walker (RIP)
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R5ky
Orange Belt
Orange Belt

Joined: 27 Jun 2022
Posts: 117


PostPosted: Tue Feb 14, 2023 12:12 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
To be a candidate for black belt, you must be at least 18 years old, and with the time-in-grade requirements, it comes out to around 8 years of active training time, and 100 teaching/assisting hours, because I consider teaching to be a valuable learning experience, even if you aren't planning to teach. Those looking to go for the instructor certificate have to put in 150 hours of teaching/assisting time. The adult curriculum runs through the three Kihongata created by Chibana, then the three Shorin-Ryu Naihanchi kata, Tawada Passai, and Kusanku Dai. For black belt, they then need to learn Shuri Sanchin, then select either Chinto, Gojushiho, or Seiyunchin to learn from me, as well as going out and learning a kata from another system, and making a kata of their own. Of course, application goes with all of the kata.

The youth curriculum isn't vastly different from the adult curriculum, except in how it is broken down, and the fact that it goes through the first three Pinan kata (with the last two optional) before getting to Naihanchi, while the adult curriculum starts with Naihanchi and doesn't use the Pinan kata. This would mean that an instructor candidate would need to learn all 5 Pinan kata, and associated application--much of which can be found in Passai, Kusanku, and Chinto, so it won't be new, but they'll need to be able to attribute it appropriately. Ideally, they'd also pick up all three of the "optional" kata for black belts. The Bugeikan material consists of Shuri Sanchin--which I already require for black belt--and the four KishimotoDi kata, which are Tachimura no Naihanchi, Nidanbu, Tachimura no Passai, and Tachimura no Kusanku. It's a LOT of material, and that's honestly pared down from what I personally know. A total of 23 kata, if you count the Kihongata as kata (not everyone does), with application, for the instructor certification, compared to just 12 for black belt--four more than I needed to know for my own black belt test, but 10 less than I actually knew at the time


Sounds like a true SOLID system, and I admire the system's standards, particularly the requirement for 8 years of active training to be considered for BB, which will undoubtedly produce quality Yudansha. What is the reasoning behind having the student go out and learn a kata from another system if I may ask?
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