Add KarateForums.com
VOTING OPEN! KarateForums.com Awards 2019!
Username:    Password:
Remember Me?    
   I Lost My Password!
Post new topic   Reply to topic    KarateForums.com Forum Index -> Health, Training and Fitness
Goto page 1, 2  Next
 See a User Guidelines violation? Press on the post.
Author Message

DWx
KF Sensei
KF Sensei

Joined: 17 Jan 2007
Posts: 6165
Location: UK
Styles: Tae Kwon Do & Yang family Tai Chi

PostPosted: Wed Feb 15, 2017 3:12 pm    Post subject: How traditional is your training? Reply with quote

Or conversely, how modern is your training?

If we look at athletes records and achievements over the last century, athletes are universally getting faster and stronger and performing better.

We can attribute this to a better understanding of biomechanics, better nutrition and a better understanding of how to break down muscle and repair it.

Yet within martial arts, especially the Eastern martial arts, tradition is king and there is an attitude that the old ways are best. My teacher did it this way, and his teacher before him. It worked for them so why won't it work for me?

But the thing is, we are better informed now. We can learn from other athletes and experts in their field to make our training more efficient and get more from our time.

So how modern do you think your training is? Do you use new training methods or stick with tried and tested ones?
_________________
"Everything has its beauty, but not everyone sees it." ~ Confucius
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message

bushido_man96
KF Sensei
KF Sensei

Joined: 31 Mar 2006
Posts: 27847
Location: Hays, KS
Styles: Taekwondo, Combat Hapkido, Aikido, GRACIE

PostPosted: Wed Feb 15, 2017 4:31 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

At our school, I don't think training is all that modernized, so to say. Basics, forms, one-steps, sparring. Stretching is done on our own before or after class (or both).

Now, with that said, I think TDK (or whatever style you practice) class should be for TKD, and the rest should be handled elsewhere. If anything else, conditioning should be slotted in for 20 to 30 minutes of the end of class (probably should be extra time as opposed to taking up class time).

Strength training, if it is going to be done right, should be done 3 days a week to start out, focusing on barbell training. When the novice effect wears off, switching to 4 days a week would probably be a good idea. These session should be kept far enough apart from the MA lessons in order to allow recovery to occur, so planning the training days is important, too.

Now, as far as "modernizing" training goes, what would that include? Should that mean we should shed the dobok and train in more athletic-appropriate attire? Should we train in shoes? Should basics be replaced with partner drills of basic techniques? These are all good questions that I think deserve a good honest look in order to maximize training time.
_________________
www.haysgym.com
http://www.sunyis.com/
www.aikidoofnorthwestkansas.com
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail

Wastelander
KF Sensei
KF Sensei

Joined: 18 Oct 2010
Posts: 2441
Location: Phoenix, AZ
Styles: Shorin-Ryu, Shuri-Ryu, Judo, KishimotoDi

PostPosted: Thu Feb 16, 2017 1:52 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I think it's important to do both, to some degree. For example, we have traditional training tools like nigiri-game, chi-ishi, and the makiwara, but we also have a full Olympic weight set, dumbbells up to 85lbs, and two full sets of resistance bands with attachments. We train our kata in the traditional manner, but also in ladder formats, or for cardio, or HIIT, etc. We do drills for control, but also do a lot of hitting pads and bags. Tradition for tradition's sake isn't really a good idea in martial arts, in my opinion, unless you are supplementing it with proper, valuable methods.
_________________
Kishimoto-Di | 2014-Present | Sensei: Ulf Karlsson
Shorin-Ryu | 2010-Present: Nidan | Sensei: Richard Poage (RIP), Jeff Allred (RIP)
Shuri-Ryu | 2006-2010: Sankyu | Sensei: Joey Johnston, Joe Walker
Judo | 2007-2010: Gokyu | Sensei: Joe Walker, Adrian Rivera
Karate Obsession | Arizona Practical Karate
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website

sensei8
KF Sensei
KF Sensei

Joined: 23 Feb 2008
Posts: 14493
Location: Houston, TX
Styles: Shindokan Saitou-ryu [Shuri-te/Okinawa-te based]

PostPosted: Thu Feb 16, 2017 1:54 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Great topic, Danielle; thanks for starting it.

Both!! At the Hombu...Both, even though there's more traditional methods for obvious reasons...Soke and Dai-Soke; both born and raised and trained in the MA from yesteryear in Okinawa.

At my dojo's...Both, and even mixture due to the fact that one way is never enough, and too much clouds up the knowledge/experience base. My brother is a Master Mechanic in and out of ASE certifications; he's been a mechanic for almost as long as I've been training in the MA. By default, he owns more tools and gadgets than anyone mechanic could ever hope for, or needs. He buys the newest tool just as soon as it comes out, whether he needs it or not...he'd rather have the tool than not have it because you just never know when you'll need it, and when you do need it, you'll be so glad that you do have it.

I'm the same way with my MA training, whether its a MA gadget or a weapon or what have you, I'll buy it for the same reason as my brother. I'm one of the few that have a 500lb AND a 1,000lb handing bag. Why? Why not?! Whatever the gadget and/or the weapon, and if I really find it beneficial, I'll get several for the dojo; I'll buy one, work it out, and then decide if it's beneficial.

At home...Both, again, yet it's at the smallest intent due to two things...my wife said so and space. In my space, I've the traditional as well as the modern because there's always another way to skin a cat.



_________________
Vote for Your Favorites in the KarateForums.com Awards 2019!


**Proof is on the floor!!!
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail

DWx
KF Sensei
KF Sensei

Joined: 17 Jan 2007
Posts: 6165
Location: UK
Styles: Tae Kwon Do & Yang family Tai Chi

PostPosted: Thu Feb 16, 2017 5:34 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thanks for the thoughts so far.


bushido_man96 wrote:
Now, as far as "modernizing" training goes, what would that include? Should that mean we should shed the dobok and train in more athletic-appropriate attire? Should we train in shoes? Should basics be replaced with partner drills of basic techniques? These are all good questions that I think deserve a good honest look in order to maximize training time.

A good example I think is to look at flexibility. In the old methods people generally forced the stretch, usually via static or ballistic methods. Nowadays we know that these types of methods must be done carefully and are better at the end of a session whereas dynamic stretching is better at the start. We can use PNF stretching to increase the range of movement and understand how to get maximum benefit out of our time.

Similarly if we are to talk fitness and cardio, rather than endless miles jogging or swimming at a set pace, we know there are benefits to HIIT type workouts so can choose to do those instead.

We can even structure our overall training better as there have been a lot of studies into periodization training. If preparing for an event we can use macro, meso and micro cycles to peak at a certain point rather than just training the same day in and day out.

"Modernising" isn't a new thing necessarily. Look at TKD, is full of modern things. When the hogu was introduced it was a huge departure from the traditional ways. Then the sensor technology they have nowadays is even more removed from the methods of the 1940s and 50s. We now have foam tatami instead of wooden floors. Foam sparring gear. Century BOBs instead of bags.
_________________
"Everything has its beauty, but not everyone sees it." ~ Confucius
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message

Spartacus Maximus
Black Belt
Black Belt

Joined: 01 Jun 2014
Posts: 1736

Styles: Shorin ryu

PostPosted: Sat Feb 18, 2017 10:15 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Being traditional in the way one trains does not have to mean copying exactly what the founders did or using the same equipment they used a century or two ago. It is the purpose and focus of training that makes it traditional not the equipment or other superficial things.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message

JazzKicker
Orange Belt
Orange Belt

Joined: 07 Aug 2017
Posts: 132
Location: NJ
Styles: JKD, TSD, MMA

PostPosted: Wed Aug 30, 2017 8:42 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

My training is modern, but I had to learn it (and do it) outside of class settings. The traditional way for me was going to a class 2-3 times a week that was well-rounded with stretching, calisthenics, techniques, forms or sparring. And that was enough for a long time. Advancing in dan ranks, though, I realized I needed supplementary training.

The big breakthrough for me was studying and getting certified as a personal trainer and Specialist in Martial Arts Conditioning. That's when I learned much more about weight training, cardio, and periodized training.

A lot of what happens in group classes, particularly traditional ones, is one-size fits all and therefore not as efficient.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message

singularity6
Pre-Black Belt
Pre-Black Belt

Joined: 26 Jun 2017
Posts: 958
Location: Michigan
Styles: Jidokwan Taekwondo and Hapkido, Yoshokai Aikido, ZNIR Iaido, Kendo

PostPosted: Wed Aug 30, 2017 10:47 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Our classes tend to be rather "traditional."

*Traditional "karate gi" for Tae Kwon Do
*Emphasis on static stretching in the beginning (not a huge fan of that...)
*Our stances are lower than a lot of other tae kwon do schools

Outside of class, I use what I learned during PT and online along with what I learn in class while training. I also research new exercises to do, as well. Mixing up cardio with resistance training is hugely important. Modern day technology also allows for more diverse exercises (exercise balls, resistance bands, etc.)
_________________
5th Geup Jidokwan Tae Kwon Do/Hap Ki Do

(Never officially tested in aikido, iaido or kendo)
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message

LLLEARNER
Brown Belt
Brown Belt

Joined: 10 Feb 2016
Posts: 687
Location: Central Maine

PostPosted: Wed Aug 30, 2017 11:51 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

My sensei does not make us do knuckle push-ups on concrete. He said his sensei did. I am beginning to wonder if that is the martial arts equivalent to walking uphill both ways to school.

He does emphasize dynamic stretching over static.
_________________
"Those who know don't talk. Those who talk don't know." ~ Lao-tzu, Tao Te Ching

"Walk a single path, becoming neither cocky with victory nor broken with defeat, without forgetting caution when all is quiet or becoming frightened when danger threatens." ~ Jigaro Kano
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message

Spartacus Maximus
Black Belt
Black Belt

Joined: 01 Jun 2014
Posts: 1736

Styles: Shorin ryu

PostPosted: Thu Aug 31, 2017 8:34 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

It is entirely possible to train in a traditional way while taken full advantage of the modern equipment and knowledge available. Modern knowledge of how the body functions, for example, is very useful for planning and optimizing training sessions.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Display posts from previous:   
Post new topic   Reply to topic    KarateForums.com Forum Index -> Health, Training and Fitness All times are GMT - 6 Hours
Goto page 1, 2  Next
Page 1 of 2
Jump to:  
You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum


< Advertising - Contact - Disclosure Policy - Staff - User Guidelines >