Is this school TOO traditional?

nj908 · White Belt

Hi all!

First off, I have some informal martial training. My dad trained in various styles and then taught me growing up. He didn't teach me really advanced things (advanced throws, or joint locks, or anything like that), but he taught me what he used as a bouncer and police officer. However, I now have the ability to formally train...but theres a problem. I'm a little skeptical. A friend of mine has a black belt in Shorinryu karate and showed me his dojo just the other day. I like his sensei. He is very nice and didn't have a problem correcting students when they were not doing something right or when he felt they could be doing better. I like that.

My biggest qualm about the dojo is I'm afraid its too traditional, and they are using techniques that are slightly outdated. I'm talking mostly about blocking with the forearm, which definitely hurts after sometime. My girlfriend is currently a 2nd degree blackbelt in Isshinryu karate(I don't want to go to her dojo and feel like I'm impeding, long story), and she didn't seem to be against the school, but she mentioned that Isshinryu was created because Tatsuo Shimabuku found faults in Shorinryu and Gojuryu karate. I could go on, and on, but thats the gist of it. Can a school be too traditional and could that be a bad thing? I'm not sure, because I could always adapt the style to what I see as more practical, right?

Thanks!

Liver Punch · Green Belt

While I pretty much entirely lack the background to make any comments on the differences in technique in just about all Chinese, Japanese, and Okinawan martial arts, I think you could benefit from broader advice. (Naturally, I think that because it is the only advice I have to give)

Step one to learning what you don't like about a martial art is to take one for a while. For example, you have a friend attending a particular dojo and you seem to have a good impression of the Sensei and everything in general. This is a very good thing. If you don't enjoy your school, you won't go, and then it won't matter "how good" the art is.

I would take Shorinryu for a year or so. After a year, you'll pick up good fundamentals and have an understanding of both the art and of what your needs are out of a martial art. If those needs are being met, you can happily stay where they are. If those needs aren't being met at all, you can find a completely new gym and start the process over.
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Wastelander · KF Sensei

You will find there are many arts that branched off from other arts because the founders of the new ones found faults in the old ones, even though those faults may not actually have been there. As for blocking with the forearm being "outdated" or "too traditional" I think you are wrong, but it depends on how the block is applied--modern police officers, security personnel and MMA fighters use their forearms to block all the time even if it doesn't look like a traditional karate-style block. Regardless, the training will toughen you up so that no matter how you use your forearms to block they will be able to stand up to the punishment. My advice would be to try out classes for a while--as Liver Punch said, about a year or maybe even two--and see how you like it. In that amount of time you should develop a solid base in how to move, how to generate power and how to absorb/receive attacks so even if you don't feel they do realistic enough training you won't have been wasting your time.
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vantheman · Blue Belt

Tradition is an interesting topic. While I study a slightly more modern self defense, my school does carry on some traditional concepts. While many are sometimes compelled to change tradition, there may be a method to the madness, aka an unknown reason for the concept. If you change tradition, you may lose the reasoning of the entire move. As for a school being to traditional, I think you should do what you feel is right. If the tradition is going to bother you, why spend time on it? Devote yourself to a martial art you will enjoy

VTM
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Kuma · Black Belt

sensei8 · KF Sensei

nj908; I'd like to welcome you to KarateForums.com

Too traditional? I don't think one could find that to be true because, imho, a style of the martial arts is either, by the styles own definition, traditional or it's not.

If the style fits ones needs across the board, then by all means, train hard and enjoy it. I'm not sure if any technique(s) can be considered "outdated", especially blocks using the forearm(s). They [forearm(s)] only hurt when one's a beginner; that [pain], as with most things, will pass. Imho, any block/deflection with the forearm(s) is a stable force to meet an opponents attack.

Out of date, to me, would indicate that 'it' is ineffective, and within Shindokan, that's just not the case concerning any forearm(s) block/deflection.

Please keep us informed on how things are going in your training and the like.

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yamesu · Black Belt

Unless you are beating each other to near concussion, and then going out to get blind on rice wine, Im not too sure its fully traditional

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Ryukyu_lover · White Belt

Should understand that the blocks that you train e.g. Soto uke, ageuke etc. aren't really effective if they're used as just a block.

My dojos practice is to train them, setup etc. and put them to work. They end up not really being "blocks" at all. Just need to keep an open mind, adapt the techniques to many different situations.

In the end, it's your decision. If you feel that the dojo is too traditional, and not to your liking, then you don't have to train it.

DaveAbramson · White Belt

My advice would be to try it... learn the basics and if at some point you feel that there is more out there to learn that this dojo can't offer, move on!
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Harkon72 · Black Belt

Traditional doesn't mean bad, blocks are that way because they work and have worked for a long time. You could argue that my style of Shukokai is not Traditional because it is at least 3rd generation in the style tree. But my point is that each block we make works because of the physicality and energy of the human body. The science is as true now as it was by the Pine Trees in Okinawa when the technique was realized.
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