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lastninja
White Belt
Joined: 21 Apr 2010
Posts: 2
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glockmeister
Green Belt
Joined: 16 Dec 2004
Posts: 490
Location: Pa
Styles: Haganah, Krav Maga, JKD, Kickboxing,BJJ, Judo
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MMA_Jim
Blue Belt
Joined: 05 Dec 2007
Posts: 275
Location: Philadelphia
Styles: BJJ, Muay Thai
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 Posted: Sat Apr 24, 2010 3:13 pm Post subject: |
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Well, you had to post it so I have to respond to it.
For those who are unaware, Im a strong advocate against krav, but I'll remain civil...
Any demo video can make any style look unbeatable. Thats to be expected, and yes every style makes demo tapes, so I cant say that "so and so style is better" on this basis because there are demo's out there (similar to this) of BJJ, Muay Thai, boxing, etc etc.
The problem I have with it is this- when you shoot a demo, you pretty much have your pick as to what you want to show- that is to say you usually put the best techniques executed beautifully and near flawlessly into your demo to make it look exceptional.
That being said...
The demo really showcases a bunch of novices based on their technique- I mean technical skills and not choice of technique.
Almost every strike thrown was poor-
No movement of their heads/hips on their knee strikes
Punching with their arms (rather than their body)
No hip movement for hip throws
Incorrect technique for a hip throw- late in the video you see someone attempt a seo nagi ( a shoulder throw) that he does very improperly that would allow someone to quickly reverse the tables with a rear naked choke. No level change for the hip toss- nothing.
Some of the time, they're picking really good techniques- they just simply dont know how to do them properly and THATS my biggest problem with Krav |
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Toptomcat
Green Belt
Joined: 04 Sep 2008
Posts: 464
Styles: Japanese and Korean karate systems, judo
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| Posted: Sat Apr 24, 2010 4:48 pm Post subject: |
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Hmmm. A lot more machismo here than good, clear video of useful martial techniques. If you're selling a martial arts instructional I'd have preferred fewer close-ups of angry bald faces and more wider, still-camera shots against a neutral background so I can see what these guys are doing- from footwork to head movement- and try to emulate it.
Not a bad transition from the shoulder throw to the armbar at 1:15, though. |
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bushido_man96
KF Sensei
Joined: 31 Mar 2006
Posts: 30188
Location: Hays, KS
Styles: Taekwondo, Combat Hapkido, Aikido, GRACIE, Police Krav Maga, SPEAR
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MMA_Jim
Blue Belt
Joined: 05 Dec 2007
Posts: 275
Location: Philadelphia
Styles: BJJ, Muay Thai
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| Posted: Tue Apr 27, 2010 9:48 am Post subject: |
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| bushido_man96 wrote: |
| That is one thing to keep in mind with demos.....demonstration usually = advertisiment. So, they naturally do what they can to sell it and make it look good. |
Thats exactly what Im saying though- most people try to make their demos look good, but these guys are such novices that their best techniques that made the highlight reel are full of mistakes.
In other words, their best effort shows them to be beginners at best |
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tallgeese
Black Belt
Joined: 04 May 2008
Posts: 6879
Location: McHenry County, IL
Styles: Brazilian Jiu Jitsu, Bujin Bugei Jutsu, Gokei Ryu Kempo Jutsu, MMA, Shootfighting, boxing, kickboxing, JKD, Pekiti Tersia Kali
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| Posted: Tue Apr 27, 2010 3:18 pm Post subject: |
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I think MMA Jim and bushido man are dead on. And I also think that's the point of the marketing, getting beginners in. Still, it doesn't make them look better in the eyes of ma-ists everywhere.
I also thin Jim has a point with the quality control issues in Krav. I've seen some that I was really impressed with. I've seen others that were just awful. Granted, this is true of everything from trad arts to mma gyms.
However, at least there is most often some level of consitancy of principles between different schools in similar arts. There are highly professional mma gyms and very amature gyms. Each cater to a differnt crowd and has a place in the scheme of things. But, you can walk into each and see the same kinds of things being taught.
I've never gotten that sense from Krav places. They just seem to be all over the board. |
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The BB of C
Black Belt
Joined: 11 Feb 2007
Posts: 1264
Location: Orlando, Florida
Styles: Kuk Sool Won, Isshin-ryu, Capoeira, Brazillian Jiu Jutsu, Judo
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| Posted: Thu Apr 29, 2010 8:28 pm Post subject: |
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| It's a cool video. As far as their defense against multiple attackers goes, I think they would spend too much time finishing off one person before dealing with the other. I would want to be able to stagger off one person long enough to switch to another person and stagger them off so I could set up a technique strong enough to finish off the other person before they could recoil. |
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Jay
Black Belt
Joined: 20 May 2005
Posts: 1190
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| Posted: Fri Apr 30, 2010 5:51 am Post subject: |
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| Toptomcat wrote: |
Hmmm. A lot more machismo here than good, clear video of useful martial techniques. If you're selling a martial arts instructional I'd have preferred fewer close-ups of angry bald faces and more wider, still-camera shots against a neutral background so I can see what these guys are doing- from footwork to head movement- and try to emulate it.
Not a bad transition from the shoulder throw to the armbar at 1:15, though. |
Close ups are done to make it look better. Everything looks much faster and covers for bad technique. Most modern martial arts movies are like this. There are very rarely full widescreen shots because often they just don't look real.
I thought as a marketing thing it looked good, but to me it seemed like a lot of the techniques were wasting time, why bother to throw and armbar when you can hit, hit, hit surely you don't want to be spending any more time with your attacker than you have to, you just want to get away.
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The key to everything is continuity achieved by discipline. |
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Akikazeninja
Yellow Belt
Joined: 15 Jul 2010
Posts: 81
Styles: Ninjutsu Jujutsu Taijutsu Commando Krav Maga
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| Posted: Fri Sep 03, 2010 9:37 am Post subject: |
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You guys have obviously never trained in commando krav maga because everything I have trained in that class is that opposite of finishing one guy before moving to the next and poor body movement. Ikno a few poliecmen and men in the military that tell me they wouldnt want any other martial art when it comes down to it, so I wouldnt bash it. But commando krav maga is diff from straight krav maga so they might not train the same as we do 
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The path leading to anger and conflict is wide and easy to travel the path leading to self control and discipline is narrow and difficult |
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on the post.
