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ashworth
Purple Belt
Purple Belt

Joined: 13 Nov 2006
Posts: 513
Location: UK
Styles: Kankoko No Ryu, shotokan, IJR Karate, Iaido

PostPosted: Thu Aug 09, 2018 6:03 am    Post subject: Learning Kobudo online? Reply with quote

After doing karate for the past 22 years I have always wanted to get into Kobudo, have looked into it a lot, seen loads of videos online. But have never found a school close enough to be able to seriously get into it.

Recently I have come across traditionaljapanesemartialarts.org. (The English on this site isn't the best...) They offer an online training solution to my situation, you sign up and pay for the content, and submit video of yourself for assessment by Shihan Nishiuchi (Have seen many videos of him before on youtube).

Now I have never really been fond of the idea of solely learning an art this way, it can be useful to help supplement your training but only as an extra on top of your training. That's what I have always thought anyway...

But what are your thoughts on this? Have any of you come across this before? anyone trained with him?
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Wastelander
KF Sensei
KF Sensei

Joined: 18 Oct 2010
Posts: 2407
Location: Phoenix, AZ
Styles: Shorin-Ryu, Shuri-Ryu, Judo, KishimotoDi

PostPosted: Thu Aug 09, 2018 8:01 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Nishiuchi Sensei has some very thorough videos that used to be on YouTube, but have since been taken down. I imagine you could pick up the basics from such videos, along with corrections from the instructor. You won't get to the same level of skill, and your progression will be slower, but if it's all you have, it's all you have. For what it is worth, I know that Neil Stolsmark Sensei has also set up an online training program for kobudo, and my Sensei thought it was pretty well done.
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MatsuShinshii
Black Belt
Black Belt

Joined: 15 Aug 2016
Posts: 1423
Location: Kentucky
Styles: Machimura Suidi Rokudan, Ryukyu Kenpo, Kobudo, Judo

PostPosted: Mon Aug 20, 2018 3:51 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

If you already have a background (meaning years or study under your belt) then yes it is possible to continue your training via vids/books and the like if this is all you have.

Having said that those avenues will never replace the teacher/ student class time. There are small bits of information that you will not get without the watchful eye of a good teacher.

If you have never received instruction... I guess you could do it, albeit a long shot, but I wouldn't suggest it as you will not get the attention to detail not will you get all of the information in a 30 minute video. It just can not replace a good teacher and the interaction you get in a class. You also will not get the diversity of training with others of varying skills so that you can not only test yourself but find what works and doesn't for you.

If that's all you have, well I guess its better than not training at all but I would highly recommend finding a good teacher to train with. Even if in another weapons art. You need to develop the fundamental techniques.

Just my 2 cents.
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tallgeese
KF Sensei
KF Sensei

Joined: 04 May 2008
Posts: 6851
Location: McHenry County, IL
Styles: Brazilian Jiu Jitsu, Bujin Bugei Jutsu, Gokei Ryu Kempo Jutsu, MMA, Shootfighting, boxing, kickboxing, JKD, Pekiti Tersia Kali

PostPosted: Tue Aug 21, 2018 9:44 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Short answer: yes. You can learn via this modality.

Longer answer: It's entirely possible. Accept there is limitation and that you'll be missing one on one, personalized answers to your questions and problems. This will create lag time in your learning curve. Now, will you have far more skill with a well designed on-line program by a qualified instructor than you ever will on your own? Absolutely! It's a question of your ability to learn from the computer.

I know, it's odd for my computer illiterate self to stand up for this, but it's a fact that technology is changing the way we learn. Everywhere. It's only surprising that it took so long for us to jump on board in the MAs.

The question really isn't, "can I learn" it's "how well done is the on-line program for me to learn from." This will be the largest contributing factor. Much like in person instruction, you'll gain far more from a systemic, building block approach that is well laid out than you will from randomized videos of techniques. As with in person schools, do your homework.

My PTK coach, who started training the system with face to face, runs an amazing on line program. As part of it, he has a private community on FB where members can ask personalized questions via video demos for clarification. That, and it's layout, make it a great resource for those who want to train kali but are not near a school (that's the case with a lot of people and a lot of arts.)

So it's a valuable thing. This is in stark contrast to what I thought a decade ago. But things progress, not because I've lowered by standards, but because tech savvy instructors have figured out how to make the most of the new methods at our disposal.
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JR 137
KF Sempai
KF Sempai

Joined: 10 May 2015
Posts: 2350
Location: In the dojo
Styles: Seido Juku

PostPosted: Tue Aug 21, 2018 10:09 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

My former sensei learned kobudo through Nishiuchiís videos. Iím not sure of how much communication he had with Nishiuchi himself through it all. He started it about 20 years ago when the internet wasnít what it is now. He had them on VHS if that gives you perspective. A little background is in order here...

My former sensei broke away from his organization (Kyokushin offshoot). The former organization had kobudo integrated into the syllabus, but it was pretty disjointed and seemed far more of an afterthought than anything else. It amounted to a weapon kata at specific ranks; a bo kata here, sai kata there, etc. There were no standardized drills, no real use of the weapon other than performing the kata. When he left, one of his first priorities was addressing the kobudo portion. He did a ton of research, and once he cane across Nishuichiís stuff, he knew it was exactly what he was looking for. As a yondan he had proficiency in handling the weapons and his karate knowledge, so it wasnít exactly like a guy who knows absolutely nothing buying them and going backyard wrestling with it.

He bought several videos and started practicing. When he felt somewhat comfortable, he had a few of his higher ranking and dedicated students (myself included) practice stuff with him informally outside normal class times. Once he felt confident with doing and teaching it, he slowly brought it to the rest of the dojo.

A little while later he found an instructor directly under Nishiuchi and visited him for a weekend (that gentleman was about 5 hours away). He states he was pretty close to what he was supposed to do and it was mostly sharpening up a few things and learning some more ways to effectively teach it. Heís still teaching it and makes trips to that person every so often.

The best thing he did IMO was take 99% of the kobudo out of the karate syllabus and make it a stand-alone thing. Karate students are responsible for some bo and I believe tonfa material at certain ranks, but more as a general knowledge thing. Some students love kobudo, others donít care for it. The ones that want to learn it get a lot more depth to it than if it was part of the karate syllabus. Heís got a solid core of his karate students learning kobudo at designated times and days. And he has a few kobudo only students too. Heís got them as separate programs with separate ranks. Heís not charging his karate students much more than their karate tuition if heís even charging them extra at all.

Long story short, you can get very good at Nishiuchiís stuff if you invest the time and energy and general basic knowledge. Itís a great system IMO. Itís not just doing a few kata and calling it a day. There are a lot of solo and partner drills involved.
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sensei8
KF Sensei
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Joined: 23 Feb 2008
Posts: 14301
Location: Houston, TX
Styles: Shindokan Saitou-ryu [Shuri-te/Okinawa-te based]

PostPosted: Wed Aug 22, 2018 7:03 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Yes!! One can learn Kodudo on-line and/or from a book. I'm just on the side of the fence that are proponents of having the experienced watchful eye of a qualified instructor in order to catch the mistakes right off the bat instead of when it counts and/or when the bad habit is deeply engrained.


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