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sensei8
KF Sensei
KF Sensei

Joined: 23 Feb 2008
Posts: 14244
Location: Houston, TX
Styles: Shindokan Saitou-ryu [Shuri-te/Okinawa-te based]

PostPosted: Thu Aug 10, 2017 7:55 pm    Post subject: Re: Preserving Jeet Kune Do or let it die? Reply with quote

Alan Armstrong wrote:
Should JKD be preserved or should it die with its creator?

There are those that have chosen to carry on Bruce Lee's vision, is this actually possible?

Here is one example of many:

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=lW31vtxTf2Y

JKD, imho, will never die because it's been to much ingrained into the MA society.

For JKD to die...interest towards JKD must no longer be of interest for the entire world.






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Alan Armstrong
Black Belt
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Joined: 28 Feb 2016
Posts: 2122


PostPosted: Fri Aug 11, 2017 3:32 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

JKD has died with its creator and has been reborn out of the ashes, now in to the heart and minds of the devotees; reincarnation promises improvement in the next time around.

Bruce Lee set the bar very high for his followers, the task of improving on his work is now in their hands.

1973(Age 33)
Bruce orders all three of his Jeet Kune Do schools closed in six months. He did not approve of some teaching methods in his absence and he felt others were taking advantage of him in some way.
source:
http://asiajeetkunedo.com/about_lee.php

What is authentic jeet kune do?
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=-jZPZ6YmqBg
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sensei8
KF Sensei
KF Sensei

Joined: 23 Feb 2008
Posts: 14244
Location: Houston, TX
Styles: Shindokan Saitou-ryu [Shuri-te/Okinawa-te based]

PostPosted: Sat Aug 12, 2017 8:02 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Alan Armstrong wrote:
JKD has died with its creator and has been reborn out of the ashes, now in to the heart and minds of the devotees; reincarnation promises improvement in the next time around.

Bruce Lee set the bar very high for his followers, the task of improving on his work is now in their hands.

1973(Age 33)
Bruce orders all three of his Jeet Kune Do schools closed in six months. He did not approve of some teaching methods in his absence and he felt others were taking advantage of him in some way.
source:
http://asiajeetkunedo.com/about_lee.php

What is authentic jeet kune do?
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=-jZPZ6YmqBg

Then I suppose that every style of the MA has died with its founder as well?!?



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JazzKicker
Orange Belt
Orange Belt

Joined: 07 Aug 2017
Posts: 119
Location: NJ
Styles: JKD, TSD, MMA

PostPosted: Mon Aug 14, 2017 9:41 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

There isn't any one Jeet Kune Do- there wasn't for Bruce Lee. His thinking and teaching evolved over time.
People have adopted different streams depending on who they learned JKD from. So there's "Original JKD", and "JKD Concepts", and people who've gone in Dan Inosanto's direction, with a stronger Filipino emphasis. I've learned from early 2nd generation students from Oakland and Chinatown, and their senior instructors.

The early students, either of Inosanto or Lee himself, are in their 70's and 80's and dying off. Given the nature of JKD and the "creative interpretations" of it, I think rather than dying it may become diluted.
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Alan Armstrong
Black Belt
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Joined: 28 Feb 2016
Posts: 2122


PostPosted: Mon Aug 14, 2017 4:24 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Wing Chun Girl vs Bruce Li

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=gdHKAkJRybs
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MatsuShinshii
Black Belt
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Joined: 15 Aug 2016
Posts: 1423
Location: Kentucky
Styles: Machimura Suidi Rokudan, Ryukyu Kenpo, Kobudo, Judo

PostPosted: Mon Aug 14, 2017 4:39 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Alan Armstrong wrote:
Wing Chun Girl vs Bruce Li

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=gdHKAkJRybs


Entertaining. Funny. But what does this have to do with JKD and whether it lives or dies with Bruce?

It's parody not real life.
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Alan Armstrong
Black Belt
Black Belt

Joined: 28 Feb 2016
Posts: 2122


PostPosted: Tue Aug 15, 2017 3:10 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

MatsuShinshii wrote:
Alan Armstrong wrote:
Wing Chun Girl vs Bruce Li

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=gdHKAkJRybs


Entertaining. Funny. But what does this have to do with JKD and whether it lives or dies with Bruce?

It's parody not real life.
Point is from the beginning of this topic, impersonation in this case parody.
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italian_guy
Black Belt
Black Belt

Joined: 26 Nov 2003
Posts: 1476
Location: Italy
Styles: Formerly in Goju ryu karate (Nidan) now in Wing chun with past experience also in krav Maga, Kickboxing, Tai chi chuan (yang) and JKD.

PostPosted: Fri Aug 25, 2017 6:24 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Let me restate the question in a different way: does JKD deserve to live?

My answer is yes, because its techniques and concepts are meaningful, usefoul and effective.

Everything evolves in human history so we don't expect that JKD today to be the same as in 1973,but Bruce Lee successors like Dan Inosanto or Kris Kent had preserved the concepts and techiques in a reasonable way and so what they teach (or teached) is still to be considered JKD.
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bushido_man96
KF Sensei
KF Sensei

Joined: 31 Mar 2006
Posts: 27629
Location: Hays, KS
Styles: Taekwondo, Combat Hapkido, Aikido, GRACIE

PostPosted: Fri Aug 25, 2017 12:08 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Alan Armstrong wrote:
How can anyone put together a Bruce Lee JKD curriculum, then tell the student "Don't worry, what doesn't work for you, just discard it"


It wasn't that simple. Sure, its nice to read his words, see his ideas, and say that it is just that easy, as say, throwing out a hook kick because I can't do it. But it wasn't all as simple as that. One has to train and be exposed to different things in applications, and then decide through training and experience if something is worth keeping or not.

Quote:
When Bruce Lee put his JKD together as a concept, he wasn't specific with the type of Boxing, Fencing, Grappling or Kung Fu, it was the idea that he could use what worked for him.


He gathered a lot of concepts from other styles, especially Boxing and Fencing, and he also had Wing Chun training. It appears he experimented with varying concepts from other styles and melded it into what he had learned, and apparently decided to keep, from his JKD days. And, he felt inclined to pass this on to some students. I imagine his classes had some structure to them, and not just a bunch of people showing up and doing whatever they wanted, adding and discarding, adding and discarding, especially with so little knowledge to begin with.

Quote:
Bruce Lee didn't hand over any keys to his martial art studio, to continue his legacy.


Yeah, well, he did kind of die rather early. He probably wasn't planning on that.
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Alan Armstrong
Black Belt
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Joined: 28 Feb 2016
Posts: 2122


PostPosted: Fri Aug 25, 2017 4:47 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

bushido_man96 wrote:
Alan Armstrong wrote:
How can anyone put together a Bruce Lee JKD curriculum, then tell the student "Don't worry, what doesn't work for you, just discard it"


It wasn't that simple. Sure, its nice to read his words, see his ideas, and say that it is just that easy, as say, throwing out a hook kick because I can't do it. But it wasn't all as simple as that. One has to train and be exposed to different things in applications, and then decide through training and experience if something is worth keeping or not.

Quote:
When Bruce Lee put his JKD together as a concept, he wasn't specific with the type of Boxing, Fencing, Grappling or Kung Fu, it was the idea that he could use what worked for him.


He gathered a lot of concepts from other styles, especially Boxing and Fencing, and he also had Wing Chun training. It appears he experimented with varying concepts from other styles and melded it into what he had learned, and apparently decided to keep, from his JKD days. And, he felt inclined to pass this on to some students. I imagine his classes had some structure to them, and not just a bunch of people showing up and doing whatever they wanted, adding and discarding, adding and discarding, especially with so little knowledge to begin with.

Quote:
Bruce Lee didn't hand over any keys to his martial art studio, to continue his legacy.


Yeah, well, he did kind of die rather early. He probably wasn't planning on that.
Bruce Lee didn't look like he was happy enough to hand over his legacy before he died.

1973(Age 33)
Bruce orders all three of his Jeet Kune Do schools closed in six months. He did not approve of some teaching methods in his absence and he felt others were taking advantage of him in some way.
source:
http://asiajeetkunedo.com/about_lee.php
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