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sensei8
KF Sensei
KF Sensei

Joined: 23 Feb 2008
Posts: 14983
Location: Houston, TX
Styles: Shindokan Saitou-ryu [Shuri-te/Okinawa-te based]

PostPosted: Thu Jan 02, 2014 4:56 pm    Post subject: Proprietary Ranks!! Reply with quote

There's a reason why the government doesn't regulate MA ranks, or the MA in general. The reason is that MA ranks are subjective to whom interprets said rank, as well as the validity of said styles.

Therefore, rank, is proprietary to...WHOM?? The governing body? The CI? The school? The practitioner? The peers of said practitioner? Just WHOM??

Hypothetically speaking, for discussion purposes...

Mr. Smith receives his black belt and all subsequent ranks through GM Jones up to 7th Dan; the highest non-honorary, non-political rank given by GM Jones in 1985. Mr. Smith becomes the Executive Vice President the governing body that was founded by GM Jones, and he held that position for the last 10 years GM Jones lived. Throughout this time, Mr. Smith was also instrumental in the development of the original syllabus/curriculum.

After GM Jones's passing, other associations were formed, one of which promoted Mr. Smith to 8th Dan in 1991. Then in 1995, several associations joined together to promote him to 9th Dan.

Through the skyrocketing promotions of Mr. Smith's 9th Dan, whom claims the proprietary rights to his 8th and 9th Dan? Certainly, GM Jones doesn't because he has passed away. The key word might be in the paragraph right above this one..."FORMED"! Nothing wrong with forming new governing bodies, they spring up quite often, some known about and some not.

By the proprietary reasoning's, whom should take accountability?

Mr. Smith could've remained a 7th Dan for the rest of his life, and this wouldn't have been such a bad thing. Integrity, I suppose, should've existed here. Others had obviously thought that Mr. Smith deserved said 8th Dan, and then 9th Dan, respectively because, after all, he did receive them from outside sources.

Possibly, Mr. Smith can not claim any proprietary rights over his 8th and 9th Dan's because he hadn't earned them from GM Jones. Albeit, the proprietary rights belong to those outside sources because they awarded them to Mr. Smith. Yes, Mr. Smith did wear his 8th Dan, and he now wears his 9th Dan, and because possession is 9/10th the law, I guess he is the owners of his 8th and 9th Dan ranks.

I don't know. What do you think??



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quinteros1963
Green Belt
Green Belt

Joined: 22 Jan 2009
Posts: 394
Location: Spring, Texas
Styles: Okinawan Martial Arts (Goju Ryu & Shotokan)

PostPosted: Thu Jan 02, 2014 6:21 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

He is as the rank was given to him. Possession is 9/10 of the law. But why would one want rank outside of his org. It's been my experience that it won't be recognized by the original org. I would say when is teacher died that there should be something in the by laws that granted his next ranks based on time. IMHO the move to ninth dan was too soon. I've often wondered what happens in cases like this. My original instructor was 8th Dan as awarded by his instructor and has been awarded 9th by Aaron Banks. I think he only claims the rank of 8 degree because it was awarded by his teacher.
On another note I was awarded my black belt from a previous instructor but never wore it at my current dojo out of respect. Knowing how that felt. I'm sure I would stay accept the honors from the other orcs, but keep the rank awarded by my instructor. Unless I became a member of the new org.
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sensei8
KF Sensei
KF Sensei

Joined: 23 Feb 2008
Posts: 14983
Location: Houston, TX
Styles: Shindokan Saitou-ryu [Shuri-te/Okinawa-te based]

PostPosted: Thu Jan 02, 2014 7:40 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

quinteros1963 wrote:
He is as the rank was given to him. Possession is 9/10 of the law. But why would one want rank outside of his org. It's been my experience that it won't be recognized by the original org. I would say when is teacher died that there should be something in the by laws that granted his next ranks based on time. IMHO the move to ninth dan was too soon. I've often wondered what happens in cases like this. My original instructor was 8th Dan as awarded by his instructor and has been awarded 9th by Aaron Banks. I think he only claims the rank of 8 degree because it was awarded by his teacher.
On another note I was awarded my black belt from a previous instructor but never wore it at my current dojo out of respect. Knowing how that felt. I'm sure I would stay accept the honors from the other orcs, but keep the rank awarded by my instructor. Unless I became a member of the new org.

To the bold type above...

I believe that the governing body that Mr. Smith was associated with splintered and/or closed after GM Jones passed away.

AND/OR

A strong desire to obtain his 8th and 9th Dan. Notice that Mr. Smith got his 8th Dan from one association, and then another different association awarded him his 9th Dan. Why not both from the same association is beyond me, except that there was a falling out or the first new association refused said 9th Dan for whatever reason(s).

Mr. Smith totally ignored the staple concerning the minimum tenure, if his original governing body ever had a rule(s) addressing said situation. Mr. Smith, wanted rank, couldn't wait, so he found a way to satisfy his obsession: RANK!!

Reasons vary; that's for sure.


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