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Alan Armstrong
Black Belt
Joined: 28 Feb 2016
Posts: 2468
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sensei8
KF Sensei
Joined: 23 Feb 2008
Posts: 16420
Location: Las Vegas, NV
Styles: Shindokan Saitou-ryu [Shuri-te/Okinawa-te based]
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 Posted: Sat Nov 18, 2017 3:56 pm Post subject: |
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You can't have one, skill and discipline, without the other because they're both interchangeable as well as interdependent on one another.
Which one came, or comes, first or simultaneous?? The skill? The discipline?
Both mature in time, however long that might be. One must have the skill to acquire the discipline, and therefore, one must have the discipline to acquire the skill.
Nurturing either haphazardly begets undisciplined skills!!
Imho!!
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**Proof is on the floor!!! |
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bushido_man96
KF Sensei
Joined: 31 Mar 2006
Posts: 30188
Location: Hays, KS
Styles: Taekwondo, Combat Hapkido, Aikido, GRACIE, Police Krav Maga, SPEAR
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DWx
Black Belt
Joined: 17 Jan 2007
Posts: 6455
Location: UK
Styles: Tae Kwon Do & Yang family Tai Chi
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| Posted: Mon Nov 20, 2017 3:47 pm Post subject: |
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What do we mean by "discipline" here? Self-discipline?
I think you can have one and not the other. Especially if we consider skill to be in-part "natural ability".
You can work really hard and still not be as good as someone with natural ability. But on the flip side you can have natural ability yet never realise your full potential because you're not disciplined enough to train hard.
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"Everything has its beauty, but not everyone sees it." ~ Confucius |
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Alan Armstrong
Black Belt
Joined: 28 Feb 2016
Posts: 2468
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| Posted: Mon Nov 20, 2017 4:04 pm Post subject: |
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Discipline, could be considered as a skill to help develope self mastery.
Obligation before diversion, is worth remembering when studying for exams.
As having a stick-to-it-ness attitude helps towards attaining goals. |
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MatsuShinshii
Black Belt
Joined: 15 Aug 2016
Posts: 1423
Location: Kentucky
Styles: Machimura Suidi Rokudan, Ryukyu Kenpo, Kobudo, Judo
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| Posted: Mon Nov 20, 2017 5:33 pm Post subject: |
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No way to obtain skill without discipline. Through discipline skill is developed.
Doesn't matter what you do. If you want to be good at it you must develop the discipline to learn and perfect it thus you develop the skill.
I guess I don't understand the question.
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The person who succeeds is not the one who holds back, fearing failure, nor the one who never fails-but the one who moves on in spite of failure.
Charles R. Swindoll |
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MatsuShinshii
Black Belt
Joined: 15 Aug 2016
Posts: 1423
Location: Kentucky
Styles: Machimura Suidi Rokudan, Ryukyu Kenpo, Kobudo, Judo
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| Posted: Mon Nov 20, 2017 5:35 pm Post subject: |
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| DWx wrote: |
What do we mean by "discipline" here? Self-discipline?
I think you can have one and not the other. Especially if we consider skill to be in-part "natural ability".
You can work really hard and still not be as good as someone with natural ability. But on the flip side you can have natural ability yet never realise your full potential because you're not disciplined enough to train hard. |
Sorry I posted too quickly and didn't read your post. If this is in terms of natural ability I would agree with you.
_________________
The person who succeeds is not the one who holds back, fearing failure, nor the one who never fails-but the one who moves on in spite of failure.
Charles R. Swindoll |
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Spartacus Maximus
Black Belt
Joined: 01 Jun 2014
Posts: 1902
Styles: Shorin ryu
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| Posted: Mon Nov 20, 2017 7:08 pm Post subject: |
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One thing that is common to both discipline and skill is that the two take time to develop. Another is that both can only be acquired through diligent training and practise.
Even with natural talent, it takes considerable discipline and conscious sustained effort to improve an existing skill or learn a new one. There is no such thing as a natural master.
Discipline, concentration and dedication is how experts came to be experts. Discipline can be taught in part, but most of it must eventually come from within. It must be self-discipline because the guidance of an instructor is not always available whenever one wishes. This is precisely the reason why martial arts instructors hope and expect their students to practise on their own time and not just in the training hall when the instructor is around. |
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MatsuShinshii
Black Belt
Joined: 15 Aug 2016
Posts: 1423
Location: Kentucky
Styles: Machimura Suidi Rokudan, Ryukyu Kenpo, Kobudo, Judo
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| Posted: Tue Nov 21, 2017 4:54 pm Post subject: |
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Wait, you're supposed to train outside of class? I must have missed this memo! 
Oh boy there are a whole lot of couch potatoes rethinking starting a MA right now. 
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The person who succeeds is not the one who holds back, fearing failure, nor the one who never fails-but the one who moves on in spite of failure.
Charles R. Swindoll |
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bushido_man96
KF Sensei
Joined: 31 Mar 2006
Posts: 30188
Location: Hays, KS
Styles: Taekwondo, Combat Hapkido, Aikido, GRACIE, Police Krav Maga, SPEAR
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| Posted: Wed Nov 22, 2017 7:01 pm Post subject: |
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| MatsuShinshii wrote: |
Wait, you're supposed to train outside of class? I must have missed this memo!
Oh boy there are a whole lot of couch potatoes rethinking starting a MA right now. |
This has been the hardest part for me over the course of the past few years, arranging some training time outside of class.
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