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MasterPain
Black Belt
Black Belt

Joined: 26 Oct 2010
Posts: 1949
Location: Parts Unknown
Styles: Bujin Bugei Jutsu, Backyard Kali, Satsui no Hadou

PostPosted: Tue Sep 11, 2012 6:19 am    Post subject: So you're dead... KEEP FIGHTING! Reply with quote

When training knife defense and such, I never let someone stop just because they know I have made a fatal series of strokes and thrusts. I feel that stopping due to what would be a serious injury goes against the mentality of self preservation. Instead, I think they should up the intensity and look for a finish quickly. Someone, maybe Musashi, said that if a Samurai should be decapitated, their will should be such that they kill their enemy before their body hit the ground.

Any thoughts?
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pittbullJudoka
Black Belt
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Joined: 25 Jun 2004
Posts: 1165
Location: Tennessee
Styles: Ryu Kyu Kempo,Wrestling,Brazilian Jiu Jitsu

PostPosted: Tue Sep 11, 2012 6:25 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I will agree with on this. In training if you get into the mind of oops I messed up and stop that's what you will do when it comes down to it. It's just the same with sparring you have got to have that never say die attitude. If you're training yourself to stop after a mistake, or a point is scored you're training for failure.
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tallgeese
KF Sensei
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Joined: 04 May 2008
Posts: 6852
Location: McHenry County, IL
Styles: Brazilian Jiu Jitsu, Bujin Bugei Jutsu, Gokei Ryu Kempo Jutsu, MMA, Shootfighting, boxing, kickboxing, JKD, Pekiti Tersia Kali

PostPosted: Tue Sep 11, 2012 6:47 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Agreed.

In addition to ma's, it's the prevalent attitude in law enforcement training these days as well. Very rarely do you run into a group training that stops the actions of an officer due to their being struck by sims rounds. The standard has become fighting on to build that mentality. The only time one of our guys goes down is if an instructor or commander puts them down so everyone else has to deal with the element of an officer down.

Grossman, an individual who's books I think everyone who carries a gun for a living should read, talks about the amount of time studies have shown an individual can live AFTER sustaining injuries that will prove fatal. It's often longer than one would think. His point in this is two fold but goes directly to your point MP.

1) Medical science is better than it's ever been, and in fact is a controlling factor in how few deaths we have from violence despite the record number of violent acts being committed. Because of this, you have to train to take on the responsibility of training to get to self, or buddy, aid despite wounds. This could save your life compared to laying down to die.

2) If there's no saving you, you've dedicated your life to living a certain way, how do you want to be remembered for your last few seconds on earth? Bleeding out on the ground or taking it to the bad guy that just ended you and seeing that he doesn't do the same to your partners or others.

So yeah, training to never stop is important. Moving through mistakes rather than resetting is a key component in developing that mindset.
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darksoul
Purple Belt
Purple Belt

Joined: 19 Jul 2012
Posts: 548
Location: Montréal, QC, Canada
Styles: Shaolin Kempo

PostPosted: Tue Sep 11, 2012 7:08 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Agreed here as well. The adrenaline in the body and will to survive can overcome some pretty nasty injuries, at least until you can find medical attention. You're dead? Fight harder than if you were alive. It might actually save your life in the end.
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YouRminE
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Joined: 19 Sep 2012
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PostPosted: Wed Sep 19, 2012 1:44 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Even the physical side seems to be getting weak if the mentality looks strong and good still an individual could survive and comeback strongly. So we have to think positive about this matter. “Sugar Ray Robinson” is the prime example for what I said.
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Dobbersky
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Joined: 19 Jul 2006
Posts: 1323
Location: Manchester. United Kingdom
Styles: Black Tiger Ashihara Karate Jutsu, Japanese Kickboxing, Cheng Man Ch'ing TaiChi

PostPosted: Wed Sep 19, 2012 5:32 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

My ethos, If I gonna die, I'm taking you with me!!!
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bushido_man96
KF Sensei
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Joined: 31 Mar 2006
Posts: 28210
Location: Hays, KS
Styles: Taekwondo, Combat Hapkido, Aikido, GRACIE

PostPosted: Wed Sep 19, 2012 7:56 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I agree. I think its important to foster a mentality of finishing the fight that way. If all someone does in class is "die" and doesn't learn to finish, then it will be tough to develop confidence when the student needs to fight through something, be it pain or whatever. You aren't out of the fight until you are dead! And even then, fall so you can trip someone...
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Groinstrike
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Joined: 26 Oct 2010
Posts: 923
Location: Richland County
Styles: Bujin Bugei Jutsu, Krav Maga, Jeet Kune Do, BJJ M

PostPosted: Thu Sep 20, 2012 8:44 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

bushido_man96 wrote:
You aren't out of the fight until you are dead! And even then, fall so you can trip someone...


This may be my new signature!!!
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Harkon72
Black Belt
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Joined: 27 Aug 2012
Posts: 1875
Location: Wales
Styles: Okinawan Karate, Aikido, Ninpo.

PostPosted: Fri Sep 21, 2012 3:51 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

The Samurai Code asked them to look for a good death, indeed to seek it. The Vikings also tried to have a death holding a sword in their hand. Dying with your boots on was a goal in some cowboy films too. I concur, it's better to go out kicking than to fade away.
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bushido_man96
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Styles: Taekwondo, Combat Hapkido, Aikido, GRACIE

PostPosted: Mon Sep 24, 2012 8:30 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Groinstrike wrote:
bushido_man96 wrote:
You aren't out of the fight until you are dead! And even then, fall so you can trip someone...


This may be my new signature!!!


Go for it! I'm glad you like it. It must be my general stubbornness and tendency to be spiteful that brings these things out at times.
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