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tallgeese
Black Belt
Joined: 04 May 2008
Posts: 6879
Location: McHenry County, IL
Styles: Brazilian Jiu Jitsu, Bujin Bugei Jutsu, Gokei Ryu Kempo Jutsu, MMA, Shootfighting, boxing, kickboxing, JKD, Pekiti Tersia Kali
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sensei8
KF Sensei
Joined: 23 Feb 2008
Posts: 16427
Location: Las Vegas, NV
Styles: Shindokan Saitou-ryu [Shuri-te/Okinawa-te based]
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 Posted: Sat May 09, 2015 7:27 am Post subject: |
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Nice tutorial, Alex, as always; thanks for sharing it.
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| That said, how does everyone here work the open guard? Movement around base? Pressure? |
How do I/We work the open guard? All of the above!! Things change! Why? Ones opponent isn't just going to "allow/let" me grab them at will without some sort of fight. The give and take can be just that; give and take. I move around the base, my opponent counters in some fashion. I pressure, my opponent counters that pressure in some fashion. In short, as in anything, nothing always happens as planned.
For training purposes, everything works. But add a resistive Uke, the game of give and take takes on a different face; surprises can, especially with beginners, birth panic.
I'm a fan of pressure!!
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| What pros and cons of each do you see? |
The prominent pro I see IS the pressure that you're applying WHILE moving around the base!! I like it!! It took me awhile to use both pressure AND moving around the base TOGETHER, and not one or the other.
The prominent con I see IS that grabbing the gi pants isn't always that easy, and even more difficult in maintaining because a resistive opponent will manipulate in such a way that grip is lost, if only for a moment. Not everyone has an iron clad grip, and one sharp flail, the grip can be lost. The possible scary scenario is that once a grasp is broken, and for that instant, that one arm can be trapped and vised in ones legs and such...submission possibility.
The pros I see for pressuring is akin to pressuring the center of the board in a chess game. Pressuring can cause my opponent to make mistakes due to the level of the pressure I'm applying; not just pressure from me, but in a highly calculated pressure. Don't move a piece on a chess board and assume that pressure will work because the hidden traps are realized when it's too late. Don't pressure just to pressure!!
That's the con of a pressure. Overly exhumed pressure backfires at it's most unpredicted moment; pressure is mistaken for dominance, and it's the farthest thing from it.
The pros for moving around the base is that elements can be checked and re-checked whilst moving around the base. Move here...fix here...move this...fix this...move that...fix that; it's a constant adjustments while moving around the base. Therefore, moving around the base isn't all static!!
The cons of moving around the base is that often students don't move enough or they move too much both intentionally and unintentionally. Fixing and adjusting this and that by a calculated and experienced practitioner is part of the game and thusly, the base is lost to an over zealous student moving around the base.
Experience fixes mistakes OVER TIME!!
BUT...no everything, including what I've posted here, works every time; experience is the deciding factor for success over failure.
Back to my corner!!
_________________
**Proof is on the floor!!! |
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tallgeese
Black Belt
Joined: 04 May 2008
Posts: 6879
Location: McHenry County, IL
Styles: Brazilian Jiu Jitsu, Bujin Bugei Jutsu, Gokei Ryu Kempo Jutsu, MMA, Shootfighting, boxing, kickboxing, JKD, Pekiti Tersia Kali
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| Posted: Mon May 11, 2015 9:29 pm Post subject: |
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Bob, that's a really good analysis. Pressure cannot be applied without restraint. That leads to being off base. That said,pressure will often make an opponent make mistakes.
For me, that's the sort of thing that is best about it. By application pf pressure you can really make people WANT you to pass due to the discomfort. I'm not talking about cheap jiu jitsu (grinding jaws, driving elbows into soft tissue, etc.) I'm talking about the clean application of pressure that is so dominating on the limbs and core that breathing is difficult and the position is uncomfortable from the bottom.
Great look at it!
_________________
http://alphajiujitsu.com/
https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCJhRVuwbm__LwXPvFMReMww |
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bushido_man96
KF Sensei
Joined: 31 Mar 2006
Posts: 30188
Location: Hays, KS
Styles: Taekwondo, Combat Hapkido, Aikido, GRACIE, Police Krav Maga, SPEAR
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| Posted: Thu May 14, 2015 5:11 am Post subject: |
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I like your pressure application here. I can see how it would be helpful, but we don't grapple with the gi, so where you get the grips near the knees, I don't know how I would adapt that to make it work for me.
_________________
www.haysgym.com
http://www.sunyis.com/
www.aikidoofnorthwestkansas.com |
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tallgeese
Black Belt
Joined: 04 May 2008
Posts: 6879
Location: McHenry County, IL
Styles: Brazilian Jiu Jitsu, Bujin Bugei Jutsu, Gokei Ryu Kempo Jutsu, MMA, Shootfighting, boxing, kickboxing, JKD, Pekiti Tersia Kali
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| Posted: Sun May 17, 2015 8:39 am Post subject: |
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Brian, great point. We focus on the use of the gi because that's what we do. That said, pressure can be applied at any point and isn't dictated by grips. The key is playing with weight. One of the drills we do is creating pressure without the use of hands at all on the part of the top party. This starts to let you work weight without the impact of the hand. It really builds some sensitivity to this sort of thing.
The grips factor to control, you'll apply pressure differently because of this, but you can really still pass with weight application this way.
_________________
http://alphajiujitsu.com/
https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCJhRVuwbm__LwXPvFMReMww |
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bushido_man96
KF Sensei
Joined: 31 Mar 2006
Posts: 30188
Location: Hays, KS
Styles: Taekwondo, Combat Hapkido, Aikido, GRACIE, Police Krav Maga, SPEAR
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| Posted: Mon May 18, 2015 12:57 am Post subject: |
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| tallgeese wrote: |
Brian, great point. We focus on the use of the gi because that's what we do. That said, pressure can be applied at any point and isn't dictated by grips. The key is playing with weight. One of the drills we do is creating pressure without the use of hands at all on the part of the top party. This starts to let you work weight without the impact of the hand. It really builds some sensitivity to this sort of thing.
The grips factor to control, you'll apply pressure differently because of this, but you can really still pass with weight application this way. |
That's a good idea, Alex. Thanks for that, I'll try to play with that idea a bit.
_________________
www.haysgym.com
http://www.sunyis.com/
www.aikidoofnorthwestkansas.com |
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omjaa
White Belt
Joined: 18 May 2015
Posts: 1
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| Posted: Mon May 18, 2015 10:57 pm Post subject: |
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| I like your pressure , thanks |
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tallgeese
Black Belt
Joined: 04 May 2008
Posts: 6879
Location: McHenry County, IL
Styles: Brazilian Jiu Jitsu, Bujin Bugei Jutsu, Gokei Ryu Kempo Jutsu, MMA, Shootfighting, boxing, kickboxing, JKD, Pekiti Tersia Kali
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| Posted: Tue May 19, 2015 8:00 pm Post subject: |
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| omjaa wrote: |
| I like your pressure , thanks |
Thank you. As my game progresses, and it's been thru several cycles, I come back to this time and again. The ability dominate the fight with efficient movement while maintaining control is appealing the older I get. It relies less on athleticism on more on technical precision.
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https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCJhRVuwbm__LwXPvFMReMww |
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on the post.
