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bushido_man96
KF Sensei
Joined: 31 Mar 2006
Posts: 30188
Location: Hays, KS
Styles: Taekwondo, Combat Hapkido, Aikido, GRACIE, Police Krav Maga, SPEAR
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 Posted: Sat Sep 20, 2008 3:17 am Post subject: |
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| Chikara wrote: |
Thanks! 
I was just thinking about how the Okinawan fisherman went to China and learned their martial arts and formed To-te and then changed into the 3 main styles of that era Naha-te, Shuri-te, and Temari-te, which then got changed by the practitioners to all these other styles. This is just the history as I was taught.
I guess what I really wanted to know was how Ninjutsu came to be.  I'm not learning it, I'm just interested in it. I'll probably do it sometime. It looks too cool not to. |
I don't think that Okinawan MAs came from China. They may have Chinese influence, but to assume that Okinawan fisherman learned Chinese arts, and that formed the roots of the Okinawan styles, I think is off. Okinawans had a system of their own, and they probably were influenced some by China.
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Chikara
Orange Belt
Joined: 27 Aug 2008
Posts: 104
Location: USA
Styles: Isshinryu, Kobudo, Aiki Jiu-Jitsu, Aikido, Judo, Wing Chun, Systema, CQB (w/ strong emphasis on Krav Maga)
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| Posted: Sat Sep 20, 2008 7:09 am Post subject: |
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Sorry I'm being so confusing. I just don't know what order to put this thing in. I mean, which came first? Ninjutsu or the other styles or both at the same time? Ok, I think I came up with a better way.  Does Ninjutsu employ all styles of Japanese/Okinawan martial arts? Or just a select few?
P.S. I was asleep when I posted the last msg. I'm no good at communicating late at night. 
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Chikara
karate es el amor de mi vida. |
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Chikara
Orange Belt
Joined: 27 Aug 2008
Posts: 104
Location: USA
Styles: Isshinryu, Kobudo, Aiki Jiu-Jitsu, Aikido, Judo, Wing Chun, Systema, CQB (w/ strong emphasis on Krav Maga)
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| Posted: Sat Sep 20, 2008 7:15 am Post subject: |
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Okinawans had trade routes with China. There's one in particular that I'm having trouble remembering the name to. There was one named Kusanku (means diplomat in Japanese), who went to China and learned martial arts and brought it back. Yes, I know the Okinawans came up with Kobudo, farming weapon martial art.
But, as I said, this is what my sensei told me. I'm too busy to research at the moment, but I will later.
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Chikara
karate es el amor de mi vida. |
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bushido_man96
KF Sensei
Joined: 31 Mar 2006
Posts: 30188
Location: Hays, KS
Styles: Taekwondo, Combat Hapkido, Aikido, GRACIE, Police Krav Maga, SPEAR
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| Posted: Mon Sep 22, 2008 11:23 am Post subject: |
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| Chikara wrote: |
| Does Ninjutsu employ all styles of Japanese/Okinawan martial arts? Or just a select few? |
Looking at Ninjitsu in this way is not really the most efficient path to take. What you want to look at is what Ninjistu would have incorporated as far as tactics went for the weapons and empty hand fighting techniques. So, you would be looking more at a skill set much like what the Samurai would have used, except possibly not as extensive, because the Ninja was not a battlefield unit. So, they would have had a system to train in swordsmanship, along with their ranged weapons of choice. As for their fighting styles, they would probably have been very focused in hand strikes and attacks used for stealth, like from behind to attack the neck/throat, but most of the times, smaller arms like daggers or dirks would have been used in accordance with these.
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Chikara
Orange Belt
Joined: 27 Aug 2008
Posts: 104
Location: USA
Styles: Isshinryu, Kobudo, Aiki Jiu-Jitsu, Aikido, Judo, Wing Chun, Systema, CQB (w/ strong emphasis on Krav Maga)
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| Posted: Mon Sep 22, 2008 8:13 pm Post subject: |
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The reason I asked was because there are people who believe that the original Ninjutsu is lost completely, and others believe it was broken down and alive and booming today.
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Chikara
karate es el amor de mi vida. |
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bushido_man96
KF Sensei
Joined: 31 Mar 2006
Posts: 30188
Location: Hays, KS
Styles: Taekwondo, Combat Hapkido, Aikido, GRACIE, Police Krav Maga, SPEAR
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Chikara
Orange Belt
Joined: 27 Aug 2008
Posts: 104
Location: USA
Styles: Isshinryu, Kobudo, Aiki Jiu-Jitsu, Aikido, Judo, Wing Chun, Systema, CQB (w/ strong emphasis on Krav Maga)
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| Posted: Tue Sep 23, 2008 7:23 pm Post subject: |
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Oh well, it's still an awesome style anyway. I think their best attribute is that they can pick up anything of any shape to use as a weapon. Also, they were the 007's of feudal Japan! How cool is that!
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Chikara
karate es el amor de mi vida. |
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TheArtofDave
White Belt
Joined: 28 Jun 2009
Posts: 23
Location: Southaven,MS
Styles: Pasaryu
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| Posted: Wed Jul 01, 2009 6:09 am Post subject: Also.. |
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I would also think that deception would achieve them in their missions. To make one thing seem as it if was, when it was the complete opposite would be a great disadvantage to your enemy, and put you in a great position of power.
Also I remember reading an article that suggested the ninja uniform was not what we came to know it as today. It was a perpetuated marketing ploy to keep the myth alive. This interests me greatly as to see what kind of feudal uniforms they would have had. |
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JusticeZero
Black Belt
Joined: 02 Apr 2005
Posts: 2166
Location: AK
Styles: Capoeira Angola
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| Posted: Thu Jul 02, 2009 2:13 am Post subject: |
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Gods only knows, but most likely, all or almost all of the component arts were variant lineages of classical jujutsu.
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"Anything worth doing is worth doing badly." - Baleia |
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tallgeese
Black Belt
Joined: 04 May 2008
Posts: 6879
Location: McHenry County, IL
Styles: Brazilian Jiu Jitsu, Bujin Bugei Jutsu, Gokei Ryu Kempo Jutsu, MMA, Shootfighting, boxing, kickboxing, JKD, Pekiti Tersia Kali
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| Posted: Thu Jul 02, 2009 3:28 am Post subject: |
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Considering their mission, I doubt they had any sort of real "uniform". More likely, they wore whatever aided in their cover identity, or allowed them to blend into the rest of the population the best.
Black clothed and masked individuals do tend to lift suspicion. Probably something they wanted to avoid.
I'd agree with Justice as well, whatever they did as far as unarmed work probably was a form of JJJ. Again, I doubt they initally had any uniform standard of unarmed training. Most likely it was whatever background training a particular individual had with formal instruction focusing mainly on esponage and stealth which was apparently their primary job description. All else was likely secondary in importance. |
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on the post.
