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sensei8
KF Sensei
Joined: 23 Feb 2008
Posts: 16430
Location: Las Vegas, NV
Styles: Shindokan Saitou-ryu [Shuri-te/Okinawa-te based]
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 Posted: Sat Apr 30, 2016 4:33 pm Post subject: Term Limits!! |
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2008|Kaicho Takahashi Sensei is elected the new Dai-Soke of the Shindokan Hombu
*Soke passes away of natural causes; he was 91 years old
*I’m elected Kaicho and Chief Instructor of the Shindokan Hombu
2009|Earned Hachidan; Shindokan Saitou-ryu Kobudo
2010|Dai-Soke passes away after suffering two separate strokes that year; he was 78 years old
*I retire from being the Kaicho and Chief Instructor of the Shindokan Hombu; promoted to Kaiso [Advisor]
*Iwao Takahashi, eldest son of Dai-Soke, is elected to San Dai-Soke, promoted to Judan
*San Dai-Soke closes the Hombu and attempts to moves it to Nanjo, Okinawa
*Established NEW Shindokan Hombu; new charter, proxy, and the like approved
*San Dai-Soke stripped of his authority and given a lifetime expulsion via a referendum by the new Hombu
2011|Re-elected as Kaicho; stepped down from Kaiso appointment |
With the excerpt from my Golden Anniversary, I'd like to draw attention to the bolded type above, more specifically, concerning my Kaicho appointment(s).
Within the SKKA By-Laws and the like, there's no existence with lifetime appointments. Two ways to rescind any elected appointment is either voluntarily or involuntarily with cause!! Supposedly, there's now a third way to rescind any elected appointment...
Term Limits!!
Thusly, I suppose that Term Limits might be under the same umbrella as voluntarily or involuntarily, depending on just how one might view either. Being put to pasture, isn't always a welcomed part of ones life, it being an involuntarily act. However, stepping down isn't always too welcomed either, it being a voluntarily act.
Well, it's like my fellow upper hierarchy's have found that Term Limits might be the way for the SKKA/Hombu to reinvent itself. Change is inevitable, and albeit, needed from time to time. Otherwise, a willingness to refuse change, ushers in an untimed death to the entity.
So, without speaking about the legalities and all in any great detail, after all, it came be quite boring, the legal language and such...so much so, that one would rather have a root canal without any anesthesia of any type.
Let's speak very briefly about my elected appointment as Kaicho [President].
The By-Laws speak about the recipient of that appointment being automatically promoted to Kudan, without any delays, immediately!! I've never agreed with that, and I still don't agree with that, and that's why I refused that more times than I care to remember. My Kudan, was awarded to me, but only after I passed a Testing Cycle; HOWEVER, this was in the absence of Dai-Soke, due to him having passed away many years earlier. That still leaves a bad taste in my mouth...even now!
Kaicho is in charge of everything, and anything, related to the SKKA/Hombu; the buck stops there, and at times, many decisions made by the Kaicho is without contestation!! Because the SKKA/Hombu is a business, daily operational concerns at the Executive Administrative level, are dealt with by the Kaicho. Kaicho's primary concerns are:
1) The Student Body
2) Business Success
Kaicho's leadership role also entails being ultimately responsible for all day-to-day Management decisions and for implementing the SKKA's/Hombu's long and short term plans. Kaicho acts as a direct liaison between the Student Body and Management, and therefore, communicates to the Student Body on behalf of the SKKA's/Hombu's Executive Team, which is comprised of General Affairs Department, Instructor Department, Administrative Department, and Regents, as well as any/all sub-level departments.
To the crux of the whole matter.
I'm Kaicho until I'm no longer the Kaicho per the powers that be, of which, I'm at the top of the food chain. Term Limits!! Here's the proposal, as of this very mornings pow-wow, with the other food chain members.
Tada...The Kaicho, for the moment, will...
Hold said elected office for ONLY 2 years!! I've been Kaicho for 7-8 years, and guess what, if this proposal becomes a reality, I'll no longer be Kaicho, until I'm reelected at a future date, and believe it or not, I'm fine with that. Anything for the betterment of the Student Body and the SKKA/Hombu.
Tricky thing is that as part of the proposal, once a sitting Kaicho is finished with their term, they can't be placed on a ballot for one full term. In short, once I've completed my current term as Kaicho, I can't be placed on the next ballot in any shape, way, and/or form. I'm fine with that too!!
Idle minds and the like have nothing else to do with themselves, so, they come up with this, which I too, am fine with. Wondering out loud if this years POTUS election and the like in the USA gave them the idea. It sure wasn't my idea, but, I'm willing, for the betterment of the Student Body and the SKKA/Hombu, to accept and embrace the change.
Continued meetings/conversations over this proposal will take us to and through this years Annual Testing Cycle this June/July at the Hombu. This will give us plenty of time to fine tune AND adopt the proposal, if it passes several key votes, that is.
Any thoughts, or whatever else??
_________________
**Proof is on the floor!!! |
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JR 137
Black Belt
Joined: 10 May 2015
Posts: 2442
Location: In the dojo
Styles: Seido Juku
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| Posted: Sat Apr 30, 2016 9:27 pm Post subject: |
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It all depends on the size of the pool of prospective leaders. And the depth. Are the same 2 people going to take turns being in charge? Are enough people qualified to make it more than "I guess it's your turn again?"
Rather than make a 2 year term limit and then be ineligible until the successor is no longer eligible, would giving others more power/more of a voice be better? Perhaps modeling it after our government, where stuff from the Kaicho has to be approved by a certain number of board members, and stuff from the board that gets vetoed by the Kaicho can be overridden by a certain number of votes.
2 years and mandatory out doesn't seem like it's conducive to continuity. I could see a 4 or 5 years and mandatory out being a bit better. But I don't see a mandatory out being the best option. If you've got someone really good and they're really steering the ship in the right direction, a mandated end of term is going to hurt more than help.
I think a 2 year term is fine if the incumbent is allowed to be reelected, but counterproductive if they're not. Perhaps cap it at 5 terms or so.
Then there's the rank issue. Are you going to promote a 7th dan to 9th dan for solely for the sake of a 2 year term? I'd imagine the 9th dan rule would have to be repealed. What if you have 5 or 6 different Kaichos in a row? Or do they vacate their 9th dan after the term is up and go back to their previous rank? While the rank issue messes things up, I think that's the least of the concerns, and it's potentially a big one IMO. Who wants an influx of karateka being promoted to 9th dan over the course of 8 - 10 years?
If the current system ain't broke, don't try to fix it. If the organization needs some new fresh voices to improve, give the fresh voices more power. As Mr. Miyagi said, balance is very important. |
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The Pred
Green Belt
Joined: 26 Jun 2003
Posts: 385
Styles: Goju Ryu
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| Posted: Sat Apr 30, 2016 11:42 pm Post subject: |
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| JR 137 wrote: |
Then there's the rank issue. Are you going to promote a 7th dan to 9th dan for solely for the sake of a 2 year term? I'd imagine the 9th dan rule would have to be repealed. What if you have 5 or 6 different Kaichos in a row? Or do they vacate their 9th dan after the term is up and go back to their previous rank? While the rank issue messes things up, I think that's the least of the concerns, and it's potentially a big one IMO. Who wants an influx of karateka being promoted to 9th dan over the course of 8 - 10 years?
If the current system ain't broke, don't try to fix it. If the organization needs some new fresh voices to improve, give the fresh voices more power. As Mr. Miyagi said, balance is very important. |
Funny I was just gonna ask the same thing regarding rank. I mean what rank is one considered to be put on the ballot? |
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DWx
Black Belt
Joined: 17 Jan 2007
Posts: 6455
Location: UK
Styles: Tae Kwon Do & Yang family Tai Chi
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| Posted: Sun May 01, 2016 11:25 am Post subject: |
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| JR 137 wrote: |
It all depends on the size of the pool of prospective leaders. And the depth. Are the same 2 people going to take turns being in charge? Are enough people qualified to make it more than "I guess it's your turn again?"
Rather than make a 2 year term limit and then be ineligible until the successor is no longer eligible, would giving others more power/more of a voice be better? Perhaps modeling it after our government, where stuff from the Kaicho has to be approved by a certain number of board members, and stuff from the board that gets vetoed by the Kaicho can be overridden by a certain number of votes.
2 years and mandatory out doesn't seem like it's conducive to continuity. I could see a 4 or 5 years and mandatory out being a bit better. But I don't see a mandatory out being the best option. If you've got someone really good and they're really steering the ship in the right direction, a mandated end of term is going to hurt more than help.
I think a 2 year term is fine if the incumbent is allowed to be reelected, but counterproductive if they're not. Perhaps cap it at 5 terms or so.
Then there's the rank issue. Are you going to promote a 7th dan to 9th dan for solely for the sake of a 2 year term? I'd imagine the 9th dan rule would have to be repealed. What if you have 5 or 6 different Kaichos in a row? Or do they vacate their 9th dan after the term is up and go back to their previous rank? While the rank issue messes things up, I think that's the least of the concerns, and it's potentially a big one IMO. Who wants an influx of karateka being promoted to 9th dan over the course of 8 - 10 years?
If the current system ain't broke, don't try to fix it. If the organization needs some new fresh voices to improve, give the fresh voices more power. As Mr. Miyagi said, balance is very important. |
JR137 makes some good points.
I'm of the opinion that it could be good to review the appointed Kaicho every so often. After all if that person is in charge of and responsible for the student body, they have to be supported by the student body and represent their best interests.
Though to me 2 years seems like a very short term. IMHO not long enough to effect any real change. Especially if the incumbent Kaicho cannot be re-elected, this 2 year turnover may stagnate change rather than promote it. I'm with JR137 in that it would be better to have any outgoing Kaicho available for re-election so that if they are doing a good job and are the best person for the job, they can serve another term.
_________________
"Everything has its beauty, but not everyone sees it." ~ Confucius |
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sensei8
KF Sensei
Joined: 23 Feb 2008
Posts: 16430
Location: Las Vegas, NV
Styles: Shindokan Saitou-ryu [Shuri-te/Okinawa-te based]
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| Posted: Sun May 01, 2016 4:56 pm Post subject: |
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| JR 137 wrote: |
| It all depends on the size of the pool of prospective leaders. And the depth. Are the same 2 people going to take turns being in charge? Are enough people qualified to make it more than "I guess it's your turn again?" |
Taking turns ISN'T going to work!! To help the Student Body and the SKKA/Hombu requires a dedication that means more than one just taking their turn to see what new life they can breath into either.
At the moment, their are 7 who are qualified to become Kaicho. 5 of them are from the Regents, and then there's Greg, our Kancho, and myself.
| JR 137 wrote: |
| Rather than make a 2 year term limit and then be ineligible until the successor is no longer eligible, would giving others more power/more of a voice be better? Perhaps modeling it after our government, where stuff from the Kaicho has to be approved by a certain number of board members, and stuff from the board that gets vetoed by the Kaicho can be overridden by a certain number of votes. |
The 2 years term is to be determined at a much later date. This number was more of an "FOR EXAMPLE", so, for now, I'm not even dwelling on that for the moment. While it's important, it's really not important, at the same time. When I first heard the number, I felt that all that Soke and Dai-Soke worked to create were slowly being flushed down the drain.
Whom would the SKKA/Hombu give more power/voice to?? If the Kaicho, is at the top of the food chain, how would giving more power/voice benefit the Student Body and the SKKA/Hombu??
Already in place, we've the Regents, which use to be called the Board of Regents, which had 12 elected members ranked from Godan to Hachidan. Whereas, now, the Regents is 5 elected members with a Hachidan rank, and no lower than a Nanadan, of which we've none.
In a nutshell...The Regents responsibilities are to oversee the Student Body...first and foremost. Secondly, they are to oversee the SKKA as far as it's growth!! Remember, there are things that the Kaicho decides that are without contestation; once decided, that decision CAN NOT be turned over by anyone!! As a business, we vote over many concerns, and not every vote is favorable; can't win them all!!
| JR 137 wrote: |
| 2 years and mandatory out doesn't seem like it's conducive to continuity. I could see a 4 or 5 years and mandatory out being a bit better. But I don't see a mandatory out being the best option. If you've got someone really good and they're really steering the ship in the right direction, a mandated end of term is going to hurt more than help. |
I agree! Remember, term length hasn't been decided, as of yet. I asked that we table that concern for the moment, and that we address that last. Why? Because I know the Regents and I know Greg and I know myself...this might take the majority of our time to finalize.
I'm with you...5 years prevents many things, and that's what I'm pushing for, and not anything less!!
| JR 137 wrote: |
| I think a 2 year term is fine if the incumbent is allowed to be reelected, but counterproductive if they're not. Perhaps cap it at 5 terms or so. |
The incumbent CAN NOT be reelected!! The incumbent must sit out ONE Ballot!! Having said that, nothings been determined on granite, as of yet.
| JR 137 wrote: |
| Then there's the rank issue. Are you going to promote a 7th dan to 9th dan for solely for the sake of a 2 year term? I'd imagine the 9th dan rule would have to be repealed. What if you have 5 or 6 different Kaichos in a row? Or do they vacate their 9th dan after the term is up and go back to their previous rank? While the rank issue messes things up, I think that's the least of the concerns, and it's potentially a big one IMO. Who wants an influx of karateka being promoted to 9th dan over the course of 8 - 10 years? |
Rank ISN'T an issue. Forgive me that I didn't make that clear, and that's my fault!! The SKKA isn't going to be a ship of fools!! While the SKKA By-Laws require the Kaicho to be promoted immediately to Kudan, that will NOT work whatsoever!!
I've placed this matter to the front burner for consideration to amend that particular By-Law. That By-Law had it's day in the sun, but, I believe that this By-Law needs to be pastured; the sooner the better!!
Once rank is earned, it can't be taken away/back!! Here's what I'm proposing:
1) Kudan can only be earned through a TESTING CYCLE!!
I fought to my dying breath against being automatically promoted to Kaicho. And only then, did I ask for, and receive, a Testing Cycle. What was good for Dai-Soke when he was promoted to Kaicho by Soke back in the day, has gone by the wayside, and when I fought against the promotion with the Board of Regents at tooth and skin, Dai-Soke, asked me once, and after I explained to him my reasons, he fully supported me. So much so, that he told the Board of Regents to shut-up, and to leave me at peace. Only after his passing, did they go back on the attack.
| JR 137 wrote: |
| If the current system ain't broke, don't try to fix it. If the organization needs some new fresh voices to improve, give the fresh voices more power. As Mr. Miyagi said, balance is very important. |
The current system isn't broken. They're not trying to fix anything, but I believe that they're sincere in wanting to reinvent our brand, and sometimes, that inevitable change is that fresh voice. Time will tell!!
Discussions have just begun, and we've other fires to put out first before Term Limits can be decided upon.
_________________
**Proof is on the floor!!! |
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sensei8
KF Sensei
Joined: 23 Feb 2008
Posts: 16430
Location: Las Vegas, NV
Styles: Shindokan Saitou-ryu [Shuri-te/Okinawa-te based]
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| Posted: Sun May 01, 2016 5:00 pm Post subject: |
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| The Pred wrote: |
| JR 137 wrote: |
Then there's the rank issue. Are you going to promote a 7th dan to 9th dan for solely for the sake of a 2 year term? I'd imagine the 9th dan rule would have to be repealed. What if you have 5 or 6 different Kaichos in a row? Or do they vacate their 9th dan after the term is up and go back to their previous rank? While the rank issue messes things up, I think that's the least of the concerns, and it's potentially a big one IMO. Who wants an influx of karateka being promoted to 9th dan over the course of 8 - 10 years?
If the current system ain't broke, don't try to fix it. If the organization needs some new fresh voices to improve, give the fresh voices more power. As Mr. Miyagi said, balance is very important. |
Funny I was just gonna ask the same thing regarding rank. I mean what rank is one considered to be put on the ballot? |
Nanadan is the most minimum rank requirement for any of the Executive Team. The Executive Team consists of Kaicho, Kancho, and Regents: that gives us 7.
_________________
**Proof is on the floor!!! |
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sensei8
KF Sensei
Joined: 23 Feb 2008
Posts: 16430
Location: Las Vegas, NV
Styles: Shindokan Saitou-ryu [Shuri-te/Okinawa-te based]
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| Posted: Sun May 01, 2016 5:20 pm Post subject: |
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| DWx wrote: |
| JR 137 wrote: |
It all depends on the size of the pool of prospective leaders. And the depth. Are the same 2 people going to take turns being in charge? Are enough people qualified to make it more than "I guess it's your turn again?"
Rather than make a 2 year term limit and then be ineligible until the successor is no longer eligible, would giving others more power/more of a voice be better? Perhaps modeling it after our government, where stuff from the Kaicho has to be approved by a certain number of board members, and stuff from the board that gets vetoed by the Kaicho can be overridden by a certain number of votes.
2 years and mandatory out doesn't seem like it's conducive to continuity. I could see a 4 or 5 years and mandatory out being a bit better. But I don't see a mandatory out being the best option. If you've got someone really good and they're really steering the ship in the right direction, a mandated end of term is going to hurt more than help.
I think a 2 year term is fine if the incumbent is allowed to be reelected, but counterproductive if they're not. Perhaps cap it at 5 terms or so.
Then there's the rank issue. Are you going to promote a 7th dan to 9th dan for solely for the sake of a 2 year term? I'd imagine the 9th dan rule would have to be repealed. What if you have 5 or 6 different Kaichos in a row? Or do they vacate their 9th dan after the term is up and go back to their previous rank? While the rank issue messes things up, I think that's the least of the concerns, and it's potentially a big one IMO. Who wants an influx of karateka being promoted to 9th dan over the course of 8 - 10 years?
If the current system ain't broke, don't try to fix it. If the organization needs some new fresh voices to improve, give the fresh voices more power. As Mr. Miyagi said, balance is very important. |
JR137 makes some good points.
I'm of the opinion that it could be good to review the appointed Kaicho every so often. After all if that person is in charge of and responsible for the student body, they have to be supported by the student body and represent their best interests.
Though to me 2 years seems like a very short term. IMHO not long enough to effect any real change. Especially if the incumbent Kaicho cannot be re-elected, this 2 year turnover may stagnate change rather than promote it. I'm with JR137 in that it would be better to have any outgoing Kaicho available for re-election so that if they are doing a good job and are the best person for the job, they can serve another term. |
I too, agree, that JR 137 made good points. You can read my response in this thread.
Check and Balances are redundantly throughout the entire SKKA/Hombu!! Everyone who's assigned at the SKKA/Hombu must have their annual reviews, and the Executive Team is even more so, must either meet or exceed expectations. If not, then they are placed on a PIP [Personal Improvement Plan] that covers up to 3 months long. Anyone on a PIP, has to pass monthly reviews before going forward up to graduating. Fail a monthly review, you're dismissed!! If anyone from the Executive Team is placed on a PIP, same thing, pass or fail. Pass, you remain in post...fail, a vote of no-confidence will occur, and that could lead to you being removed from post.
_________________
**Proof is on the floor!!! |
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JR 137
Black Belt
Joined: 10 May 2015
Posts: 2442
Location: In the dojo
Styles: Seido Juku
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| Posted: Sun May 01, 2016 8:01 pm Post subject: |
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From your OP, I took the hidden meaning of what was trying to be done was take some power away from the Kaicho (you or your successor, but not making it personal).
I don't know the power structure of your organization, and nor am I asking it. In taking different parts of your post, in some ways it seems the Kaicho is just another voice that coordinates the various departments, yet in other ways it seems like the Kaicho has absolute power. I'm assuming it all depends on the topic.
I think avoiding a lifetime appointment to the position is a good thing. The only lifetime appointment to that position should be the founder IMO. Not having terms (regardless of if they're eligible to serve consecutively, how long, etc.) creates quite a few problems. And just because something isn't broken doesn't mean it can't get better with some tweaking.
Change is good. In fact it can be great. But change for the sake of change doesn't make sense.
From this thread and the various posts you've had in the past, it seems to me the the board is looking to take the organization to the next level. It wants to get out of the dark ages, technologically speaking, and make their name and what they stand for known to anyone who wants to know, without compromising the product on the floor. That's a great thing IMO. The organization also probably wants to expand without compromising their integrity. That goes hand in hand with technology/presence.
It seems like there's too much "paralysis by analysis" in the organization, and they're looking to shake things up a bit. You've alluded to it many times.
Sorry if I'm rambling without focus. I forgot... What was the question?  |
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The Pred
Green Belt
Joined: 26 Jun 2003
Posts: 385
Styles: Goju Ryu
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| Posted: Sun May 01, 2016 9:42 pm Post subject: |
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| So if the person chosen is a Nanadan. Do they do the hachidan testing, then a week later the kudan testing? Just so it seems they didn't skip a rank? |
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sensei8
KF Sensei
Joined: 23 Feb 2008
Posts: 16430
Location: Las Vegas, NV
Styles: Shindokan Saitou-ryu [Shuri-te/Okinawa-te based]
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| Posted: Sun May 01, 2016 11:25 pm Post subject: |
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[quote="JR 137"]From your OP, I took the hidden meaning of what was trying to be done was take some power away from the Kaicho (you or your successor, but not making it personal).
I don't know the power structure of your organization, and nor am I asking it. In taking different parts of your post, in some ways it seems the Kaicho is just another voice that coordinates the various departments, yet in other ways it seems like the Kaicho has absolute power. I'm assuming it all depends on the topic.
I think avoiding a lifetime appointment to the position is a good thing. The only lifetime appointment to that position should be the founder IMO. Not having terms (regardless of if they're eligible to serve consecutively, how long, etc.) creates quite a few problems. And just because something isn't broken doesn't mean it can't get better with some tweaking.
Change is good. In fact it can be great. But change for the sake of change doesn't make sense.
From this thread and the various posts you've had in the past, it seems to me the the board is looking to take the organization to the next level. It wants to get out of the dark ages, technologically speaking, and make their name and what they stand for known to anyone who wants to know, without compromising the product on the floor. That's a great thing IMO. The organization also probably wants to expand without compromising their integrity. That goes hand in hand with technology/presence.
It seems like there's too much "paralysis by analysis" in the organization, and they're looking to shake things up a bit. You've alluded to it many times.
Sorry if I'm rambling without focus. I forgot... What was the question? |
Your interpretation is quite on the money, generally speaking, and on each of your paragraphs!!
I will always welcome change, however, if I perceive that it'll hurt the Student Body and/or the SKKA/Hombu, I'll fight against it. As you've noted, change has to make sense, and to make changes just because they can, is a death blow to any entity.
Yes, for the most, Kaicho's authority is absolute without contestation, and this has a lot to do more with Administration than any of the other departments. There are proprietary responsibilities within the SKKA/Hombu that give Kaicho that absolute authority per how Soke wrote the By-Laws. Once Soke and Dai-Soke had passed, and they knew that time would come, the Kaicho had to have that same authority as they had when they were in office.
No, you're not rambling, at all!!
Also, even though you're not asking, I've touched briefly on our "power structure" in my OP...
| Quote: |
| Kaicho's leadership role also entails being ultimately responsible for all day-to-day Management decisions and for implementing the SKKA's/Hombu's long and short term plans. Kaicho acts as a direct liaison between the Student Body and Management, and therefore, communicates to the Student Body on behalf of the SKKA's/Hombu's Executive Team, which is comprised of General Affairs Department, Instructor Department, Administrative Department, and Regents, as well as any/all sub-level departments. |
The bold type is the upper hierarchy of the SKKA!!
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**Proof is on the floor!!! |
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on the post.
