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OneKickWonder
Purple Belt
Purple Belt

Joined: 17 Feb 2018
Posts: 513

Styles: Tang soo do

PostPosted: Sat Jun 09, 2018 6:10 pm    Post subject: The paradoxical irony of martial arts training Reply with quote

I think when most folks start martial arts training, I reckon they have visions of becoming fit and strong and agile and tough. And I reckon we do, for the most part, achieve all those things and more.

If I train twice per week, each week I seem to achieve just that little bit more, be it in terms of stamina or agility or focus or quality of technique. I achieve such improvements because I work very hard, and I rest effectively between sessions (resting effectively does not mean doing nothing, it means doing enough to keep everything movingbut without inducing fatigue).

But what about spontaneity?

After a good but hard session yesterday, today I got into a running race with my son. Bad idea. Despite my best efforts, I simply couldn't command my legs to move any faster than a rather awkward jog.

This is not unusual. The day after a good session, I am less fit and agile than before I started training. Many of my peers have similar anecdotes.

There is a simple solution. Don't train as hard. Don't get past the first beads of sweat. But then you don't achieve anything.

So the paradoxical irony seems to be, train hard to become better, within a rigid framework, or be as good as you can be all the time, by not training hard, in which case as good as you can be used not actually that good.
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mushybees
Orange Belt
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Joined: 16 Nov 2014
Posts: 196
Location: UK
Styles: Wado ryu

PostPosted: Sat Jun 09, 2018 6:23 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

There's something wrong if your training is impacting you that much on your off days.
What should happen is that you're worst gets progressively better, not necessarily that your best is better under ideal conditions.
I hope that makes sense
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OneKickWonder
Purple Belt
Purple Belt

Joined: 17 Feb 2018
Posts: 513

Styles: Tang soo do

PostPosted: Sat Jun 09, 2018 6:50 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

mushybees wrote:
There's something wrong if your training is impacting you that much on your off days.
What should happen is that you're worst gets progressively better, not necessarily that your best is better under ideal conditions.
I hope that makes sense


It does

My post was partially tongue in cheek.

I know this because there's been a few occasions over the years when I've felt so decrepit after a session, but then there's been a reason for my adrenaline to start pumping, and despite the fatigue and stiffness and soreness, I've suddenly become ready for anything.

But that said, I do like to rain sweat and hear my own heart beat when training. Otherwise I come away feeling down, as though I've not had my money's worth so to speak.
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mushybees
Orange Belt
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Joined: 16 Nov 2014
Posts: 196
Location: UK
Styles: Wado ryu

PostPosted: Sun Jun 10, 2018 5:01 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I find there are classes where I enjoy a sweat and other times I need something more cerebral. I try and weight train 3 x a week, I can't do that if I'm always recovering from too strenuous a karate class.

Personally I'd prefer I get my exercise outside of ma classes. I need my sensei to teach me to fight, I can exercise myself. That said it's good to see how you perform whilst fatigued.
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singularity6
Pre-Black Belt
Pre-Black Belt

Joined: 26 Jun 2017
Posts: 958
Location: Michigan
Styles: Jidokwan Taekwondo and Hapkido, Yoshokai Aikido, ZNIR Iaido, Kendo

PostPosted: Sun Jun 10, 2018 6:18 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I'm not one who likes to get a daily workout... So I prefer my MA classes to go a bit harder. I might train/workout a day or 2 outside of class.
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LLLEARNER
Brown Belt
Brown Belt

Joined: 10 Feb 2016
Posts: 687
Location: Central Maine

PostPosted: Sun Jun 10, 2018 6:54 am    Post subject: Re: The paradoxical irony of martial arts training Reply with quote

OneKickWonder wrote:
I think when most folks start martial arts training, I reckon they have visions of becoming fit and strong and agile and tough. And I reckon we do, for the most part, achieve all those things and more.

If I train twice per week, each week I seem to achieve just that little bit more, be it in terms of stamina or agility or focus or quality of technique. I achieve such improvements because I work very hard, and I rest effectively between sessions (resting effectively does not mean doing nothing, it means doing enough to keep everything movingbut without inducing fatigue).

But what about spontaneity?

After a good but hard session yesterday, today I got into a running race with my son. Bad idea. Despite my best efforts, I simply couldn't command my legs to move any faster than a rather awkward jog.

This is not unusual. The day after a good session, I am less fit and agile than before I started training. Many of my peers have similar anecdotes.

There is a simple solution. Don't train as hard. Don't get past the first beads of sweat. But then you don't achieve anything.

So the paradoxical irony seems to be, train hard to become better, within a rigid framework, or be as good as you can be all the time, by not training hard, in which case as good as you can be used not actually that good.


I have had a few sessions that torched my legs so bad I walked funny for 3-4 days or so. I attribute it at least partially to being out of shape. We were holding deep stances a lot those classes. The worst one was the day after I started running. Stubborn me did not ease into the running. I did about 2 miles and half that at a sprint.

If there was one thing I could have from my younger days, it would be my recovery.
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sensei8
KF Sensei
KF Sensei

Joined: 23 Feb 2008
Posts: 14254
Location: Houston, TX
Styles: Shindokan Saitou-ryu [Shuri-te/Okinawa-te based]

PostPosted: Sun Jun 10, 2018 4:16 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Aren't the side effects of MA training simply refreshing; to the point of "OMG"??

Training hard is necessary, but to the point of torture should be nominal.

But then there's this...

No Pain, No Gain!!



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bushido_man96
KF Sensei
KF Sensei

Joined: 31 Mar 2006
Posts: 27629
Location: Hays, KS
Styles: Taekwondo, Combat Hapkido, Aikido, GRACIE

PostPosted: Mon Jun 11, 2018 2:42 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

It simply has to do with adaptation. The body adapts to the stresses that it is subjected to over time. If you do Martial Arts two times a week, your body becomes adapted to this. If you start throwing in other stuff at random, then the body had trouble adapting to the extra work load, especially if it doesn't stay consistent.

Case in point, the foot race you had. Now, if you take up a running program and work it into what you do alongside your MA training, your body will begin to adapt to that as well, and when you do have to run spontaneously, you'll perform better at it.
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Fat Cobra
Orange Belt
Orange Belt

Joined: 14 Jul 2018
Posts: 129
Location: Fort Drum, NY
Styles: Ryukyu Kempo

PostPosted: Mon Jul 30, 2018 7:47 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

One of my favorite quotes:

"Pain is the best instructor but no one wants to attend his class!"

Train hard my friends!
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OneKickWonder
Purple Belt
Purple Belt

Joined: 17 Feb 2018
Posts: 513

Styles: Tang soo do

PostPosted: Mon Jul 30, 2018 9:24 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Fat Cobra wrote:
One of my favorite quotes:

"Pain is the best instructor but no one wants to attend his class!"

Train hard my friends!


With respect, I'll add that to my list of terrible quotes along with, no pain no gain, pain is weakness leaving the body, and fall down seven times get up 8 times.

Pain is evolutionary genius. Pain tells us that physical damage is being done. It's message is, 'keep doing that and you will develop life changing injury or you might even die'.

Of course we don't learn that message often until we have actually caused significant damage to ourselves. One of the most highly regarded individuals in history, Mohamed Ali, worked through the pain. He realised that to be the best of the best in his game he needed more than the ability to keep punching. He needed to be able to absorb his opponents punches. In his prime he seemed indestructible. Towards the end he could barely even speak. His brain had just taken too many knocks.

Sports science has moved on a lot in the last couple of decades. All the old pain related 'inspirational' sayings have long been discredited. Even in the field of combat sport we're seeing a shift towards sensible precautions.

Pain is indeed a good teacher. It teaches us to stop doing things that are stupid.
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