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bushido_man96
KF Sensei
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Joined: 31 Mar 2006
Posts: 30167
Location: Hays, KS
Styles: Taekwondo, Combat Hapkido, Aikido, GRACIE, Police Krav Maga, SPEAR

PostPosted: Tue Aug 14, 2007 1:49 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Whether you get hit first, or let them move first, you still can put yourself at a disadvantage on the street with a mentality like that. It is hard to know when they are actually going to move, and as I stated, action usually beats reaction.
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nine_weapons
Orange Belt
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Joined: 31 Jul 2007
Posts: 155

Styles: muay thai, judo, bjj

PostPosted: Tue Aug 14, 2007 2:46 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

marie curie wrote:
nine_weapons wrote:
marie curie wrote:
IMHO,

Defending is not when I get punched and then attack- that is not self-defense; that is revenge.

Defending is when I get punched at then attack. When I defend myself I am taking a preventative measure against becoming a victim.

Although, I never really thought of it offense/defense, I think of it as defense/punishment, because I don't attack people unless they attack me... disliking jail and such...


I may be wrong, but I think this is along the lines of what BM was talking about - this is more of a victim style mindset. you won't attack unless you are attacked first. I on the other hand will attack FIRST If I feel an attack is inevidable. This is the pre-emptive strike which he referred to.

In many schools, they teach only to defend, and not to attack unless you are attacked first. I won't say this is a bad thing per se, but it can place you in the situation of not having time to use your skills to defend yourself, because that one strike may have been all it took for him to KO you.


I don't worry about getting in the first punch, but if someone attacks me, I'm going to defend myself well...very well. and if they end up in the hospital or something, I'd rather not end up in jail, thank you very much


using myself as an example:

I weigh 230 lbs.
I bench press 330
I squat 475
I deadlift 475

I have been into MA off and on since I was 6, have competed in the ring and bounced in clubs. If we are in an altercation and I hit you first, you may not get a chance to defend yourself. that is why pre-emptive strikes are great. you are going off of the assumption that you will be able to retaliate.

I have a pair of CLEAR knucks made of bullet proof glass. since they are clear, you may not notice I am wearing them. Even if I am smaller than you, if I hit you with them you will likely go down. if you strike me first, however, the advantage is yours.
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cross
Black Belt
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Joined: 22 Jan 2003
Posts: 1904
Location: Australia

PostPosted: Wed Aug 15, 2007 3:09 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
using myself as an example:

I weigh 230 lbs.
I bench press 330
I squat 475
I deadlift 475

I have been into MA off and on since I was 6, have competed in the ring and bounced in clubs. If we are in an altercation and I hit you first, you may not get a chance to defend yourself. that is why pre-emptive strikes are great. you are going off of the assumption that you will be able to retaliate.

I have a pair of CLEAR knucks made of bullet proof glass. since they are clear, you may not notice I am wearing them. Even if I am smaller than you, if I hit you with them you will likely go down. if you strike me first, however, the advantage is yours.


Great example. Following on from that, there has been research which shows in a large number of stabbings, the person being attacked doesnt even realise they are being stabbed, or that the attacker has a knife until they have already been cut several times.

With this in mind, taking the initiative and stopping an attack before it happens, either verbally or physically, is the safest and strategically smartest option to maximize your chance of survival.
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bushido_man96
KF Sensei
KF Sensei

Joined: 31 Mar 2006
Posts: 30167
Location: Hays, KS
Styles: Taekwondo, Combat Hapkido, Aikido, GRACIE, Police Krav Maga, SPEAR

PostPosted: Wed Aug 15, 2007 3:48 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

cross wrote:

With this in mind, taking the initiative and stopping an attack before it happens, either verbally or physically, is the safest and strategically smartest option to maximize your chance of survival.


I like this approach. You can go on the offensive verbally, just as well. I didn't really think about it. Thanks for bringing it up, cross.
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cross
Black Belt
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Joined: 22 Jan 2003
Posts: 1904
Location: Australia

PostPosted: Wed Aug 15, 2007 3:51 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
I like this approach. You can go on the offensive verbally, just as well. I didn't really think about it. Thanks for bringing it up, cross.


Certainly. When survival is your goal, any method that ensures this is useful. The verbal especially, because if you can talk someone out of a physical confrontation then the situation works out better for everyone involved. And whilst trying to talk you way out should always be the first option, if things are going to turn physical, hit first and hit hard.
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nine_weapons
Orange Belt
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Joined: 31 Jul 2007
Posts: 155

Styles: muay thai, judo, bjj

PostPosted: Thu Aug 16, 2007 10:36 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

cross wrote:
Quote:
using myself as an example:

I weigh 230 lbs.
I bench press 330
I squat 475
I deadlift 475

I have been into MA off and on since I was 6, have competed in the ring and bounced in clubs. If we are in an altercation and I hit you first, you may not get a chance to defend yourself. that is why pre-emptive strikes are great. you are going off of the assumption that you will be able to retaliate.

I have a pair of CLEAR knucks made of bullet proof glass. since they are clear, you may not notice I am wearing them. Even if I am smaller than you, if I hit you with them you will likely go down. if you strike me first, however, the advantage is yours.


Great example. Following on from that, there has been research which shows in a large number of stabbings, the person being attacked doesnt even realise they are being stabbed, or that the attacker has a knife until they have already been cut several times.

With this in mind, taking the initiative and stopping an attack before it happens, either verbally or physically, is the safest and strategically smartest option to maximize your chance of survival.


very true. I know someone who lost an eye because it was cut in a fight with a boxcutter. she also has several scars. she said that she was fighting someone, saw them swinging and thought they were just punching. she never saw the blade and did realize she was being cut.

I know other people who have said the same. until they saw the blood or until after the confrontation was over, they didn't even know a blade was involved.
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