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Iron Arahat
Red Belt
Joined: 08 Aug 2001
Posts: 846
Location: Canada
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 Posted: Sat Aug 25, 2001 11:29 am Post subject: |
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I think there's still more to patterns. For those of you who have done two person sets, you learn distance, speed timing, fotwork, and so on. Same with two person weapon sets.
Even though it may be a set routine, you have to be on your toes, and know how to properly execute techniques, especially defensive move. |
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ts757
Orange Belt
Joined: 31 May 2001
Posts: 171
Location: Leeds
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| Posted: Sat Aug 25, 2001 11:44 am Post subject: |
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Maybe some people dont practise karate to help them with street fights??? Angus?
I have only used karate outside the dojo once, and that was because people were trying to drag one of my friends away to force him to play football (he doesnt like football) and we had a bus to catch. I kicked one persons hand away, sweeped him. The other guy sweeped another person and pushed another (who lost balance and fell to the ground) the remaining person walked off muttering. We caught the bus in time.
I did not think about kata or karate in any way, it was all instinctive. Kata is there for mental discipline and practising the ART of karate. It also helps to develop techniques and stances in a semi realistic environment.
Quite frankly I hope I dont have to use anything I have learnt to truly defend myself in the future. I like my face the way it is. |
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Joecooke007
Brown Belt
Joined: 24 Nov 2001
Posts: 720
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| Posted: Wed Nov 28, 2001 4:13 pm Post subject: |
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I for one believe that kata is extremely important in the street. It shows you combinations that you may not have come up with on your own. 
_________________
Boards don't hit back.
-Bruce Lee |
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jakmak52
Green Belt
Joined: 21 Oct 2001
Posts: 356
Location: Gulfport, Florida
Styles: ITF TKD (Chang Hon) & Shotokan
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| Posted: Wed Nov 28, 2001 4:18 pm Post subject: |
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Kata/forms/poomse/hyungs etc,etc are good for my stamina and endurance building, along with focus and concentration to those little details those picky judges look for..  |
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jakmak52
Green Belt
Joined: 21 Oct 2001
Posts: 356
Location: Gulfport, Florida
Styles: ITF TKD (Chang Hon) & Shotokan
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| Posted: Wed Nov 28, 2001 4:20 pm Post subject: |
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On 2001-06-25 05:34, Angus wrote:
First let me state what i see kata as, and then i will press my point.
Kata is a group of set movements which are to be carried out in a smooth and graceful manner, simulating a conflict with one or multiple opponents. It teaches grace and discipline and allows the student to learn to combine movements together.
Now to what i want to say. I don't like kata. I will do it in order to discipline myself but i really do despise kata. No offense to Ms Williams whatsoever but i am glad that i am not doing Taesujutsu, as in her intro it says that one has to learn i think the number was 18 kata to go for 1st degree black belt.
I'm am very much the crosstrainer and from my 12 years of experience i have found that kata, well at least for me, is very useless. 
It in no way betters your street self-defense, and i mean in NO way at all, and i get frustrated greatly when i find myself wasting time trying to learn a kata to pass a test. I'm sure thaiboxerken will back me up to a degree.
Now don't get me wrong, kata is good for some people who want to learn that, and that is the point of my post, to learn what you people want. Kyoshi Ebanez (my instructor in Goju Ryu Karate) is very heavy on kata, and i find it a most refreshing lesson in discipline when we do kata for an hour and a half, but i am very much into the kumite side of things.
What do you think about kata?
Angus 
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Thanks Angus, I like the whole kit n kaboodle, except for that necessary evil that entails STRETCHING...  |
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SaiFightsMS
KF VIP
Joined: 28 Oct 2001
Posts: 6397
Location: Ohio
Styles: Shotokan, Shorin Ryu, Shi-to Ryu
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| Posted: Wed Nov 28, 2001 4:39 pm Post subject: |
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What an interesting hodgepodge of opinions. I see opinions are strong whether for or against. Amazingly strong is some cases.
I view what I do as not only an art but something that is alive. To each of us who appreciate kata the same kata may evoke it's own feelings and applications. The mind set each of us approach a kata with is a unique thing.
Kata is one of my favorite parts of karate but, I realize it is not all there is in the world of karete do.
My favorite use of kata is as a discipline and as a mind set to enter into to help fight the things in the world that are my ongoing enemies - the vicious things and curves life can throw. |
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Angus
Black Belt
Joined: 21 Jun 2001
Posts: 1064
Location: Australia
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| Posted: Wed Nov 28, 2001 8:10 pm Post subject: |
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JOECOOKE, i noticed that u said u do Goju Ryu karate. Have you ever done anything else before?
I found that almost all of the people that did Goju Ryu (when i did it for a couple of months) had had no prior martial arts expereince and were constantly fed the line that the kata they were learning could be applied effectively in the street. Also in Goju Ryu when drilling our kicks we had to keep our hands by our sides, and we weren't allowed to kick to the legs.
You said in your last post, and i quote,
"I for one believe that kata is extremely important in the street. It shows you combinations that you may not have come up with on your own" - spoken like a true deciple of the outdated and ineffective system of Goju Ryu Karate. I'm sorry if i offended u with this post man, but i thought i should let u know that the style u are studying is going to give u a false sense of confidence and u r gonna get your butt kicked if u come across a half decent fighter, even if u'r a Goju black belt. I hold nothing but a 7th Kyu in HapKiDo and i could outspar these guys (probly cos i've been doing freestyle since i was 6).
If u like kata and want to learn to fight (effectively) then do Kyokushin or Shotokan Karate, or Shi-to Ryu or anything but Goju. Goju Ryu's for old guys with bad backs (as many of the iunstructors were). Take my advice as a fighter, if that's what u wanna be, get out of Goju and do something else, anything else, boxing, taekwondo, jujutsu, but stop wasting your money man. I wouldn't care if Goju Ryu was wiped off the face opf the earth over night and the style was never practiced again, the people who i met there were so closed minded to other styles.
I did a basic commando roll on the floor and one of the brownbelts (mind u, this guy was ready to grade for his blackbelt) asked me "doesn't that hurt?" I laughed at him for half an hour cos i didn't think that he was serious.
Gees i hope Goju Ryu is the style u study, i'm sure i read it somewhere on ur details.
Later duders.
Angus
_________________
Courage is resistance to fear, mastery of fear, not absence of fear. |
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jakmak52
Green Belt
Joined: 21 Oct 2001
Posts: 356
Location: Gulfport, Florida
Styles: ITF TKD (Chang Hon) & Shotokan
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| Posted: Thu Nov 29, 2001 4:42 am Post subject: |
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On 2001-06-25 23:14, Angus wrote:
I think i will bow out of my own conversation now too, as i am being misunderstood. Sorry peoples.
Angus
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Hey, don't give up , I'm right behind you on this one  |
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SBN Doug
KF VIP
Joined: 04 Nov 2001
Posts: 3767
Location: Houston, TX
Styles: Kuk Sool Won
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| Posted: Thu Nov 29, 2001 5:02 am Post subject: |
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18 to 1st degree!!?? Wow, that is alot.
We learn 1 for each belt rank. So that make 5 to black. I appreciate them in this small amount just because when I do them in a really low stance, they are a really good workout. I like to do them on different surfaces, and contouring land so I can practice my technique and balance under different circumstances. |
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Angus
Black Belt
Joined: 21 Jun 2001
Posts: 1064
Location: Australia
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| Posted: Thu Nov 29, 2001 12:55 pm Post subject: |
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Oh yeah, that post above wasn't having a go at kata or Joe personally, just the system of Goju Ryu. I don't make judgements (full on judgements) until i have either sparred against or participated in a particular style. Seriously Joe, if u wanna be a fighter then i suggest u get out of Goju Ryu. I hear Goju Kai is harder than Goju Ryu, but only marginally. They believe that to fully memorise something u need to practice it 2500 times. Something to do with muscle memory.
Laterz,
Angus
_________________
Courage is resistance to fear, mastery of fear, not absence of fear. |
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on the post.
