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infinitehand
Yellow Belt
Yellow Belt

Joined: 14 May 2013
Posts: 25
Location: Macon, GA
Styles: Okinawa Goju-Ryu

PostPosted: Mon Dec 09, 2013 5:20 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I like to think there are no blocks in Karate. Like you say misunderstood.
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Zimlock
White Belt
White Belt

Joined: 26 Apr 2014
Posts: 13
Location: United Kingdom
Styles: Shotokan Karate, Aikikai Aikido

PostPosted: Sun Apr 27, 2014 10:05 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Traditional blocks are not always just blocks. They are arm breaks, pins, throws- if you're using an age-uke to block a punch you may find it is slow because it's too powerful. That's why we prepare by sticking our other arm out- to deflect in case we aren't quick enough, and then the age uke becomes a strike to the now exposed arm.
Traditional MA require more thought. Every move is a swiss army knife and knowing where to look takes time.
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chrissyp
Orange Belt
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Joined: 16 Jan 2013
Posts: 175

Styles: Muay Thai/ Shotokan

PostPosted: Wed Apr 30, 2014 4:03 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I can't believe how long this has been since I read this post! I've gain so much perspective since then.

Great feed back! I no longer just "block", I deflect and create openings while striking the limb.
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sensei8
KF Sensei
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Joined: 23 Feb 2008
Posts: 15453
Location: Houston, TX
Styles: Shindokan Saitou-ryu [Shuri-te/Okinawa-te based]

PostPosted: Wed Apr 30, 2014 4:05 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

chrissyp wrote:
I can't believe how long this has been since I read this post! I've gain so much perspective since then.

Great feed back! I no longer just "block", I deflect and create openings while striking the limb.

Excellent!!


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chrissyp
Orange Belt
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Joined: 16 Jan 2013
Posts: 175

Styles: Muay Thai/ Shotokan

PostPosted: Wed Apr 30, 2014 4:21 pm    Post subject: Re: Two part question: Backfist vs jab, and Karate blocks Reply with quote

sensei8 wrote:
The back fist, if properly executed, is NOT a weak jab, no, it's on the contrary. Yes, the hips, legs, and the transitional shift do drive the technique, but it's also the whipping/snapping motion of the back fist that increases the impact. Where the elbow is aiming towards, that is where the fist will contact said target.

The back fist can also strike in a downward motion. Usual targets for that type of back fist is the top of ones head, top of shoulder, and while intercepting either a hand or a foot/knee, as well as to the groin.

You could use either a back fist or a jab whenever the need presents itself; personal desire might decide which one to use over another. If you're more comfortable with one over another, than stick with what one knows. However, lend a lot of time to properly learn and practice the back fist until you're acclimated to it.

"Traditional blocks", imho, aren't going to help you much, if at all, until you are very well versed in them, especially in the venues you're speaking about. To use the right tool, no matter what it is and what it is for, takes plenty of time to learn, understand, and adapt. I'm not saying that "traditional blocks" won't work at all. No. I'm just saying for a MAist that's not well versed in them, success will be quite limited.

For the time, stay with your strongest tool, and then slowly introduce them into your desired venue. As in anything, experience is something that has to be cultivated properly before its fruits can be appreciated and enjoyed.

The only wrong mentality to have while learning is to just give up. Be open and experience for yourself what works and what doesn't work...for YOU!! Until you're more versed in Shotokan, you'll respond more likely in the core that you're most effective with. Having said that, you might not ever be comfortable with Shotokan because your core is your comfort zone, and in that, you know your core much more than you know Shotokan.




Being as this was posted about a year ago, ill give you an updated...as I became more versed in Shotokan, i've started to successfully be able to implement the techniques, it took a lot of work to get out my comfort zone, but it's been worth it. I've learned so much more, for both MMA striking and kickboxing, it's helped my left handed game (i'm a righty) significantly, and it's made me fall in love with martial arts all over again. What you said about the it taking awhile for the fruits of my work to be enjoyed, you were spot on it...it did take me a while, but it's been so worth it. My mind has been opened now to so many things now, it's been quite a great journey!
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sensei8
KF Sensei
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Joined: 23 Feb 2008
Posts: 15453
Location: Houston, TX
Styles: Shindokan Saitou-ryu [Shuri-te/Okinawa-te based]

PostPosted: Wed Apr 30, 2014 4:34 pm    Post subject: Re: Two part question: Backfist vs jab, and Karate blocks Reply with quote

chrissyp wrote:
sensei8 wrote:
The back fist, if properly executed, is NOT a weak jab, no, it's on the contrary. Yes, the hips, legs, and the transitional shift do drive the technique, but it's also the whipping/snapping motion of the back fist that increases the impact. Where the elbow is aiming towards, that is where the fist will contact said target.

The back fist can also strike in a downward motion. Usual targets for that type of back fist is the top of ones head, top of shoulder, and while intercepting either a hand or a foot/knee, as well as to the groin.

You could use either a back fist or a jab whenever the need presents itself; personal desire might decide which one to use over another. If you're more comfortable with one over another, than stick with what one knows. However, lend a lot of time to properly learn and practice the back fist until you're acclimated to it.

"Traditional blocks", imho, aren't going to help you much, if at all, until you are very well versed in them, especially in the venues you're speaking about. To use the right tool, no matter what it is and what it is for, takes plenty of time to learn, understand, and adapt. I'm not saying that "traditional blocks" won't work at all. No. I'm just saying for a MAist that's not well versed in them, success will be quite limited.

For the time, stay with your strongest tool, and then slowly introduce them into your desired venue. As in anything, experience is something that has to be cultivated properly before its fruits can be appreciated and enjoyed.

The only wrong mentality to have while learning is to just give up. Be open and experience for yourself what works and what doesn't work...for YOU!! Until you're more versed in Shotokan, you'll respond more likely in the core that you're most effective with. Having said that, you might not ever be comfortable with Shotokan because your core is your comfort zone, and in that, you know your core much more than you know Shotokan.




Being as this was posted about a year ago, ill give you an updated...as I became more versed in Shotokan, i've started to successfully be able to implement the techniques, it took a lot of work to get out my comfort zone, but it's been worth it. I've learned so much more, for both MMA striking and kickboxing, it's helped my left handed game (i'm a righty) significantly, and it's made me fall in love with martial arts all over again. What you said about the it taking awhile for the fruits of my work to be enjoyed, you were spot on it...it did take me a while, but it's been so worth it. My mind has been opened now to so many things now, it's been quite a great journey!

This is what I'm talking about, I'm so very proud of your progress. The great thing about that is that, there's so much more ahead in your MA training. I'm glad that you see that the "blocking" is actually a deflection, no matter the core, imho!!

I'm glad that I was able to help you; it's my honor!!

Now, you go rock and roll and you train HARD!!



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CredoTe
Red Belt
Red Belt

Joined: 26 Jul 2013
Posts: 776
Location: Ohio, USA
Styles: Matsubayashi-Ryu (Shorin-Ryu), Hung Gar (Hung Siu Lum)

PostPosted: Wed Apr 30, 2014 9:50 pm    Post subject: Re: Two part question: Backfist vs jab, and Karate blocks Reply with quote

sensei8 wrote:
chrissyp wrote:
sensei8 wrote:
The back fist, if properly executed, is NOT a weak jab, no, it's on the contrary. Yes, the hips, legs, and the transitional shift do drive the technique, but it's also the whipping/snapping motion of the back fist that increases the impact. Where the elbow is aiming towards, that is where the fist will contact said target.

The back fist can also strike in a downward motion. Usual targets for that type of back fist is the top of ones head, top of shoulder, and while intercepting either a hand or a foot/knee, as well as to the groin.

You could use either a back fist or a jab whenever the need presents itself; personal desire might decide which one to use over another. If you're more comfortable with one over another, than stick with what one knows. However, lend a lot of time to properly learn and practice the back fist until you're acclimated to it.

"Traditional blocks", imho, aren't going to help you much, if at all, until you are very well versed in them, especially in the venues you're speaking about. To use the right tool, no matter what it is and what it is for, takes plenty of time to learn, understand, and adapt. I'm not saying that "traditional blocks" won't work at all. No. I'm just saying for a MAist that's not well versed in them, success will be quite limited.

For the time, stay with your strongest tool, and then slowly introduce them into your desired venue. As in anything, experience is something that has to be cultivated properly before its fruits can be appreciated and enjoyed.

The only wrong mentality to have while learning is to just give up. Be open and experience for yourself what works and what doesn't work...for YOU!! Until you're more versed in Shotokan, you'll respond more likely in the core that you're most effective with. Having said that, you might not ever be comfortable with Shotokan because your core is your comfort zone, and in that, you know your core much more than you know Shotokan.




Being as this was posted about a year ago, ill give you an updated...as I became more versed in Shotokan, i've started to successfully be able to implement the techniques, it took a lot of work to get out my comfort zone, but it's been worth it. I've learned so much more, for both MMA striking and kickboxing, it's helped my left handed game (i'm a righty) significantly, and it's made me fall in love with martial arts all over again. What you said about the it taking awhile for the fruits of my work to be enjoyed, you were spot on it...it did take me a while, but it's been so worth it. My mind has been opened now to so many things now, it's been quite a great journey!

This is what I'm talking about, I'm so very proud of your progress. The great thing about that is that, there's so much more ahead in your MA training. I'm glad that you see that the "blocking" is actually a deflection, no matter the core, imho!!

I'm glad that I was able to help you; it's my honor!!

Now, you go rock and roll and you train HARD!!




Yes! The fruits of training hard and "Ah HA!" moments!
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