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Nevinyrral
Blue Belt
Blue Belt

Joined: 16 Jul 2010
Posts: 276
Location: Poland
Styles: Karate

PostPosted: Sat Nov 06, 2021 12:23 pm    Post subject: Uchi uke Reply with quote

Hello there
Just a quick question on how everyone performs uchi uke block?
During my time with shotokan I always did it with my thumb facing to the outside.
But few weeks ago I took part in Oyama karate training and they did it with thumb facing inside. And to tell you the truth it made more sense as they used the same surface you use for gedan barai, age uke and soto uke.
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Zaine
Black Belt
Black Belt

Joined: 31 Aug 2005
Posts: 1817
Location: Dallas, TX
Styles: Matsumura-Seito, Shobayashi-Ryu, Shudokan, Long Fist, American Street Karate, Southern Mantis, HEMA

PostPosted: Sun Nov 07, 2021 7:19 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I'm really bad with Japanese terminology, I didn't learn it when I was first learning karate, but this is a side block, right? I Googled it.

In Matsumura Seito we did two different uchi uke. Mostly, the stuff that came from the Matsumura lineage had the uchi uke with the thumb facing inward toward our bodies. Anything that we did from Shorinji-Ryu was thumb facing outward. That said, having the palm facing toward your opponent is interesting. Our open hand blocks and shuto uke did this, but I don't think we ever did it with a closed hand. That's an interesting way to do it, I'll have to play around with it.
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Miick 11
Yellow Belt
Yellow Belt

Joined: 01 Jan 2021
Posts: 68


PostPosted: Tue Nov 09, 2021 11:59 pm    Post subject: Re: Uchi uke Reply with quote

Nevinyrral wrote:
Hello there
Just a quick question on how everyone performs uchi uke block?
During my time with shotokan I always did it with my thumb facing to the outside.
But few weeks ago I took part in Oyama karate training and they did it with thumb facing inside. And to tell you the truth it made more sense as they used the same surface you use for gedan barai, age uke and soto uke.



I do Shorin ryu Matsamura Sieto from Kosei Nishihira

Inner or outer block is not a ' block' neither do the words uchi or uke mean block .

Also a 'side block' can be to the inside or outside .

Outside ; Our technique ( say for the right side ) is to move off line / evade , cover and deflect with the left palm / shuto - arms crossed . Then uncross arms and strike at the others outside right elbow at the 'weak point' with your right 'uchi uke' - with your knuckles , while your left moves back ready for follow up punch . ( Crane 'flaps wings' .)

So the thumb is up and knuckles to the outside .

Inside : Your right would come straight in, with the middle joint of the ring finger, slightly extended and strike the incoming fist at the base , around TH4 or LI5 . This time you end the movement with your arms crossed - ready for the next 'opening wings' manouver . (Crane flaps wings and strikes with beak.)

In many styles this first deflection movement with the other arm/hand before the 'block'/stike has remained and morphed into a punch like manouver , or that arm and hand is extended outward ... then pulled in and the block performed .

see 7:05 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FVJ5YbyWZ8M

- the right arm blocks, then is extended out forwards before being drawn back as the left blocks , then that is extended forward.

or

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=

4:44 open hand extended , arm extended , then pulled back as the other arm blocks .

You see it with dowward block ( and neither gedan or bari means block either ) as well ; the other hand is exteded downwards ( 'speared ' down ) then drawn back as the other arm drops to do the 'downward block ' . Also as this arm is extended, the blocking arm comes up to the side of the head .... a tilted 'wings ' crossed movement .

For 'gedan bari' the knuckles strike the side of the attacking leg's kneecap , the other hand spearing down first is the deflection (as you move IN and offline - with your 'cresent step' ), you continue moving in past the kick and stike outward at the kneecap with your knuckles .

Same with upper block, you ofetn see people exteding their opposite arm up and forward in a fascist salute .... then the opposite arm comes up and blocks as the lead arm retracted .

I would like to know the SENSIBLE reason why some do this . ( When I was taught it I was told it was 'to sight the block's path' ...

You also spot it in their kata , especially before the first upward block in Penan Nidan .

Ever wondered why in kata and kihon one practices gedan bari moving forward , but in application drills you move back ?

Its all there for a reason ..... which seems lost to most nowadys .

It all got changed to fore arms blocking onto forarms ... more suitable form for introduction into the school curriculum .
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sensei8
KF Sensei
KF Sensei

Joined: 23 Feb 2008
Posts: 15511
Location: Houston, TX
Styles: Shindokan Saitou-ryu [Shuri-te/Okinawa-te based]

PostPosted: Tue Nov 16, 2021 1:21 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

The methodology/ideology of Shindokan's Uchi Uke is that we don't block; we deflect. This is shared by many, if not all, Okinawa styles in extreme close relationship with our Ashi Sabaki, Foot Movement.

Each and every technique in Shindokan's true goal are two-fold, which are to trap and to get behind our opponent as quick as possible. Hence why we strive to keep our extremities close to our body.

Our chambered deflection hand/arm do not cross all the way to the other side of ones body. We're far more compact, in which, our deflecting hand/arm goes no further than ones nipple. Therefore, we engage our hips along with our Ashi Sabaki, as well as our posture; everything starts and ends at the same time, yet, there's a buildup to said target...kind of like the calm before the storm.

The other hand/arm isn't static at all. It shoots straight out to said target in its supportive role. Both hands/arms travel close to the body for the most part of the deflections arc.

More of a motion that's similar to the snapping of a towel, being careful as to not drift the elbow away from the front of the body. This also makes it very difficult to tense the chest muscle, which makes it effective.

Our hand/fist doesn't face upward to the sky, aka, turn completely over. For its most part, the orientation of our hands/arms don't change from start to finish.

The shorter the better in the travel arc to said target.



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