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jaypo
Purple Belt
Purple Belt

Joined: 26 Apr 2012
Posts: 520

Styles: Shotokan, Shorin Ryu

PostPosted: Tue May 20, 2014 7:38 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

My reasoning for that is based on the fact that wrestlers seem to do very well in the sport. And if you've followed the career of Lyoto Machida, he had been undefeated for years because his style prevented his opponents to figure him out. He used the angles and counter attacks that his karate training provided, and the majority of his opponents could not touch him. His 1st knockout came when he got caught behind the ear from Shogun. He lost 2 decisions (that most thought he won), one of which was to a high level wrestler, and he was choked out by Bones, who probably walks around 40lbs heavier than Machida. Most people agree that the best base to start from to be an MMA fighter is wrestling because the transition is easier. Couple that with a striking art (I prefer karate for the reasons above, but Muay Thai would be my close 2nd choice), and add submissions to the game, and I'd think you'd have close to the perfect fighter.

Look at this scenario- if you're familiar with MMA, take Anderson Silva and Chris Weidman. Both are high level grapplers- Silva, a BJJ black belt, and Weidman, a high level wrestler. Both have great striking. But in both of their fights, Weidman totally outgrappled Spider the entire time they were engaged. Nothing against BJJ, but I think that only relying on BJJ may win you some fights, but when pitted against someone that has elite wrestling as well, they would have trouble. That's why I would prefer submission wrestling. Keep in mind that I'm making these statements as they pertain to MMA matches.
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bushido_man96
KF Sensei
KF Sensei

Joined: 31 Mar 2006
Posts: 28973
Location: Hays, KS
Styles: Taekwondo, Combat Hapkido, Aikido, GRACIE

PostPosted: Thu May 22, 2014 4:19 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I see what you are saying now. The way you define "submission wrestling" helped out there. Good points, very well made. Thank you for taking the time to elaborate a bit.
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username18029
White Belt
White Belt

Joined: 30 May 2014
Posts: 3
Location: Canada
Styles: My own.

PostPosted: Fri May 30, 2014 8:19 pm    Post subject: Re: Why I may drop karate Reply with quote

guird wrote:
I may choose to stop training karate, as I'm having a lot of trouble making it work together with kickboxing. my kickboxing seems to be holding me back from progressing in karate, and my karate seems to be holding me back in kickboxing. In any case, each one is taking up time that could be used to train the other, and karate has a lot of travel time involved while the rest have very little.

If I were to stop with karate it would save a lot of time, and open up slots in my schedule for additional boxing and kickboxing.

A few of the reasons they conflict:
in karate I am always told to impact my roundhouse with the top of my foot, while in kickboxing I kick with the shin, and I know from kicking the heavy bag that using the top of the foot hurts my ankle joint.

The way I move in kickboxing which involves shifting my weight from foot to foot to manage distance and put my weight behind my punches, lifting my heel as I do so to facilitate the pivoting. This is wholly different from the way we move in karate, and being used to moving this way results in poor technique in karate.

When I've done a lot of kickboxing, I tend to nearly throw hooks in karate sparring. I catch myself on time, but it's still an annoyance.

Hikite seems to be conflicting with the reflex to keep my hands up.

I'm told to block mawashi geri with one arm in karate while moving off at an angle. I often fail to move off at an angle on time, so I prefer to use both arms to block. Using only one arm isn't so bad in point sparring, but if I were to do it in kick boxing I'd be hit.

Also, since I need to split my time over so many different arts, my progression in them is extremely slow.

On the other hand, I do enjoy karate and I get along very well with the others in my dojo.

thoughts?


Here is my advice. I'll tell you what I have done, and you take what you want from it.

I don't just go to ___ dojo anymore. Instead, I just learn from different styles and take what works for me.

For example, you stated that "...in karate I am always told to impact my roundhouse with the top of my foot, while in kickboxing I kick with the shin, and I know from kicking the heavy bag that using the top of the foot hurts my ankle joint" So don't use your foot anymore. Focus more on your shin. If you think that doing it with your shin is more effective, than focus on that.

My main point is, you should be able to take what you find most useful from each style and incorporate it into your own. That way, you don't lose anything.
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guird
Orange Belt
Orange Belt

Joined: 21 Jun 2013
Posts: 198

Styles: BJJ, MMA, Gongkwon Yusul

PostPosted: Sat May 31, 2014 5:07 pm    Post subject: Re: Why I may drop karate Reply with quote

[quote="Christian Martyr"]
guird wrote:


My main point is, you should be able to take what you find most useful from each style and incorporate it into your own. That way, you don't lose anything.


That would be simple enough, if it weren't for the fact that in karate I am required to kick with the foot, and required to pull my hand back. Picking and choosing isn't as simple as making a decision, the reflexes built by one training confound the reflexes built by another.
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sensei8
KF Sensei
KF Sensei

Joined: 23 Feb 2008
Posts: 15453
Location: Houston, TX
Styles: Shindokan Saitou-ryu [Shuri-te/Okinawa-te based]

PostPosted: Sun Jun 01, 2014 8:16 am    Post subject: Re: Why I may drop karate Reply with quote

[quote="guird"]
Christian Martyr wrote:
guird wrote:


My main point is, you should be able to take what you find most useful from each style and incorporate it into your own. That way, you don't lose anything.


That would be simple enough, if it weren't for the fact that in karate I am required to kick with the foot, and required to pull my hand back. Picking and choosing isn't as simple as making a decision, the reflexes built by one training confound the reflexes built by another.

Solid post!!



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