Kata-What is the point in it?

Neil · Orange Belt

Hi,

I made this post after looking at the Goju post and other postings made and just want to make it a little clearer on what the katas are actually for and how they are supposed to be used for maximum affect.

NHB and other combat sports are against kata because they see kata as fighting technique as do Martial Artists themselves. But kata is not techniques.

KATA IS A RELIGIOUS DANCE THAT CONTAINS SYMBALS NOT FIGHTING TECHNIQUES, FIGHTING TECHNIQUES ARE DERIVED FROM THE SYMBALS, FROM THE KATA!

Karate is kata. End of! That is it. Kata is all that is karate. Kata or karate, is a thinking mans game, not a flippy floppy sport where we score a point and get a trophy for are flippancy. Kata is a studying game, you must think, 'what is this movement teaching me to do?' but when you apply it it will LOOK nothing like it was in the kata. Fighting will never look like a kata do in million years, thats why when people rush through the kata, the stronger the faster the better, they have completely missed the point.

Kata are symbals for you to make the best application for your own body type, that is why certain katas are meant for different size people. I think from this, katas are grouped together into a system to fit a certain body type, buts thats just me hypothesising, but to me it makes some sense as to why we have styles.

Anyway back to kata, this way of thinking that kata are fighting techniques have lead to innapropiate applications that we can see across virtually every dojo in the world. Such as the upper forearm block, age uke. That was never made to be applied as a block but to smash your forearm into the person neck. And what is the hikate for every time you punch. Its application is pulling their pectorial muscle or kidney, and pulling that muscle, bringing the person in close to smack, so you have a pull push affect to take someone out. gedan barais can be throws, not just the attck to the groin, which I personally don't like, because you have kicks to do that for you, and it certainly isn't a block!

You reall have to analyze why the kata is making this movement, it is not clear-cut. Because a symbal looks like a block, think, use-your-head, remember there is no time for a block in a street confrontation, your only self defence is your offence, preemptive strikes work a lot better, the most violant and aggresive and co-rodinated man will always win, not the one who can put a wrist lock on!

But certain parts of kata are to be respected as religious and not fighting and this is in the goju katas from the bow, and the hands going from the top of the head to the groin, and at the end with the bow and yoi. People have said you have your hands in front of your groin to stop someone kicking you there. I would love it if someone would be willing to try that out. The only way to stop your self getting kicked in the groin is to move it!

Anyway just thought I might cover briefly some aspects of the actuall point of doing kata and what kata is not.

Neil

Natural · Blue Belt

Well, to be honest you know alot about katas, then me kata is like a ryhthem like a ballet taken to a rountine, by practice it helps you to imaginary oponent or something I don't really know.
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A karate punch it is like a dasvasted stick blow. Instead, a blow of Kung Was is comparable to a lash with a chain that has attacked, allaltra extremity one ball of ferro

ramymensa · Black Belt

let's not forget that a lot of informations were given to us by japanese in order to misunderstand some techniques. Indeed age uke is not quite a good block unless one wishes to break one's arm

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The good thing is many instructors learnt the right thing afterwards and they teach OK. A good instructor would eventually poit out the mistakes and give the right solution. Kata is still vital for a karateka and learning it the right way can only improve the technique.
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World Shotokan Karate

aznkarateboi · Brown Belt

Age-Uke can also be used to deflect a blow upwards and create an opening. However, I don't think that is the most effective use of the block. Every block done traditionally is clearly an arm breaking move, you can see this by paying attention to how both hands move. Usually one hand (the pulling hand) is securing the opponent's arm while the other is being smashed into the limb.

martialartsresearcher · Orange Belt

Well... Kata builds up strength,speed,endurence,stamina and techneque. And don't forget balance too. basicly kata is an excercise. As you already know. but as one Karate Forum member once said. (Kata is a love/hate relationship with any MA practator.) end quote. Anyways, i hope this helps. See ya.

ESA-Shotokan · Orange Belt

Only reply for me here is to refer to my post, "Lesson for the week".

Drunken Monkey · Black Belt

i think people mistake the kata as being a set of moves when in fact it is a set of movements.

very slight/subtle difference but an important one.
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equaninimus · Purple Belt

What DM said.
Kata is often referred to by McDojo types (see the recent Discovery channel "Extreme Martial Arts" fiasco) as "A fight aginst a series of imaginary opponents," and viewed sequentially. This is incorrect. The "I block and counter him, then I turn, and block and counter the next guy" seems to have been the interpertation favoured by the university clubs in pre-war Japan, and thus was passed on to the US in the 1950s and 1960s. The Okinawans never saw kata this way, and the Okinawan schools that flourished in teh US usually taught kata oyo in their curriculum. It was only in the later 1970s that the understanding of kata as "technique bank" rather than as "preserved fight scene" began to emerge into the mainstream.
Unfortunately the "block, then punch" mentality remains popular, especially in "commercial" schools, where there is less time to devote to actually learning karate. It is also still prominent in the dojo of many Japanese instructors who emigrated in the 1960s and 1970s.
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Shorinryu Sensei · Black Belt

kotegashiNeo · Blue Belt

THe truth behind kata is explained in the Bubishi, and I assure you it is most certainly not a religious dance. I don't mean to smash your thread but you should spend less time typing more time practicing kata and the bunkhai (application of the kata).
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