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mushybees
Orange Belt
Joined: 16 Nov 2014
Posts: 199
Location: UK
Styles: Wado ryu
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 Posted: Sun Jun 24, 2018 2:15 am Post subject: |
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As a wadoka I use a naihanchi stance where the toes are pointed ever so slightly inwards. The rotation is cause by rotating the head of the femur inwards, not the knees or ankles.
Whilst speaking to a physiotherapist about other issues I asked his opinion of the stance and it's long term implications for knee health. His opinion was that it isn't good for the knee but it would lead to being lighter on one's feet. He didn't elaborate on how.
He was also a martial artist so I value his opinion. |
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Wastelander
KF Sensei
Joined: 18 Oct 2010
Posts: 2734
Location: Phoenix, AZ
Styles: Shorin-Ryu, Shuri-Ryu, Judo, KishimotoDi
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| Posted: Wed Jun 27, 2018 1:23 pm Post subject: |
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| mushybees wrote: |
As a wadoka I use a naihanchi stance where the toes are pointed ever so slightly inwards. The rotation is cause by rotating the head of the femur inwards, not the knees or ankles.
Whilst speaking to a physiotherapist about other issues I asked his opinion of the stance and it's long term implications for knee health. His opinion was that it isn't good for the knee but it would lead to being lighter on one's feet. He didn't elaborate on how.
He was also a martial artist so I value his opinion. |
I'm a major proponent of ensuring that the knees always track in-line with the feet, since I have pronated feet and bad knees (from birth). You can do that with the toes pointed in but, as you said, you have to turn the femur, not just the feet, and be aware of your structure to ensure that is happening with the inward-pointed toes. Interestingly, at least based on how we do Naihanchi-dachi, I would disagree with your PT friend--I'm decidedly LESS mobile in that stance than, for example, a shiko-dachi with the toes pointed out 
_________________
Kishimoto-Di | 2014-Present | Sensei: Ulf Karlsson
Shorin-Ryu/Shinkoten Karate | 2010-Present: Yondan, Renshi | Sensei: Richard Poage (RIP), Jeff Allred (RIP)
Shuri-Ryu | 2006-2010: Sankyu | Sensei: Joey Johnston, Joe Walker (RIP)
Judo | 2007-2010: Gokyu | Sensei: Joe Walker (RIP), Ramon Rivera (RIP), Adrian Rivera
Illinois Practical Karate | International Neoclassical Karate Kobudo Society |
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mushybees
Orange Belt
Joined: 16 Nov 2014
Posts: 199
Location: UK
Styles: Wado ryu
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| Posted: Thu Jun 28, 2018 7:49 am Post subject: |
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| Wastelander wrote: |
I'm a major proponent of ensuring that the knees always track in-line with the feet, since I have pronated feet and bad knees (from birth). You can do that with the toes pointed in but, as you said, you have to turn the femur, not just the feet, and be aware of your structure to ensure that is happening with the inward-pointed toes. Interestingly, at least based on how we do Naihanchi-dachi, I would disagree with your PT friend--I'm decidedly LESS mobile in that stance than, for example, a shiko-dachi with the toes pointed out |
Wadoka use naihanchi as an exercise for developing internal structure.
I can't speak for every wado dojo but I have never spent significant dojo time exploring naihanchi's application. Not because they don't exist, because it's obviously full of combative principles, but because I think the wado pedagogy is to purposefully divorce it from application. It's where wado's koryu jujutsu and kenjutsu pedigree is particularly apparent.
The problem with that is naihanchi is not an easy entry point to developing internal power and there are few people willing and able to teach it. I've fleetingly trained in a few chinese internal arts and some of the similarities to naihanchi are interesting.
It's an avenue I'm interested in exploring further and I've found a style agnostic teacher, I just have to find the time to work on some of the solo exercises before visiting.
I didn't get in to it with the physio. I believe the stance itself doesn't permit much mobility but it's long term structural impact is an increased mobilty in a more neutral stance.
He didn't seem to notice my femurs were rotated in and my knees and ankles were neutral so who knows what assumptions he was making. |
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Fat Cobra
Green Belt
Joined: 14 Jul 2018
Posts: 372
Location: Watertown, NY
Styles: Ryukyu Kempo
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| Posted: Tue Jul 17, 2018 9:45 am Post subject: |
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| mushybees wrote: |
| Wastelander wrote: |
I'm a major proponent of ensuring that the knees always track in-line with the feet, since I have pronated feet and bad knees (from birth). You can do that with the toes pointed in but, as you said, you have to turn the femur, not just the feet, and be aware of your structure to ensure that is happening with the inward-pointed toes. Interestingly, at least based on how we do Naihanchi-dachi, I would disagree with your PT friend--I'm decidedly LESS mobile in that stance than, for example, a shiko-dachi with the toes pointed out |
Wadoka use naihanchi as an exercise for developing internal structure.
I can't speak for every wado dojo but I have never spent significant dojo time exploring naihanchi's application. Not because they don't exist, because it's obviously full of combative principles, but because I think the wado pedagogy is to purposefully divorce it from application. It's where wado's koryu jujutsu and kenjutsu pedigree is particularly apparent.
The problem with that is naihanchi is not an easy entry point to developing internal power and there are few people willing and able to teach it. I've fleetingly trained in a few chinese internal arts and some of the similarities to naihanchi are interesting.
It's an avenue I'm interested in exploring further and I've found a style agnostic teacher, I just have to find the time to work on some of the solo exercises before visiting.
I didn't get in to it with the physio. I believe the stance itself doesn't permit much mobility but it's long term structural impact is an increased mobilty in a more neutral stance.
He didn't seem to notice my femurs were rotated in and my knees and ankles were neutral so who knows what assumptions he was making. |
Mushybees,
I study Ryukyu Kempo (originally developed by Taika Oyata). The 3 Naihanchi Katas are the first 3 katas we learn, and then continue to develop and refine throughout our entire lives. In fact, Naihanchi Shodan is probably the "flagship" kata of Ryukyu Kempo. The kata, at its basic level, teaches structural integrity with stance and footwork moving between naihanchi dachi and kosa dachi. Also, the bunkai for the kata, as interpreted in Tuite Jitsu (seize hand art...or joint locks) is phenomenal. Naihanchi Shodan alone has 12 Tuite Jitsu / Self Defense moves in it.
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Yondan in Ryukyu Kempo
Head of the Shubu Kan Dojo in Carthage, NY
(United Ryukyu Kempo Alliance) |
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