|
|
| Author |
Message |
Kuma
Black Belt
Joined: 03 Dec 2008
Posts: 1092
|
 Posted: Sat Jun 23, 2012 3:17 am Post subject: |
 |
|
They're legal, there's just not too many guys skilled with them. Cung Le used them well in his fight against Frank Shamrock.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CLHFqj_FY8k |
|
| Back to top |
|
 |
ShoriKid
Pre-Black Belt
Joined: 14 Dec 2007
Posts: 900
Styles: Matsubyashi-Ryu, Okinawan Kempo, wrestling, bits of BJJ
|
| Posted: Sat Jun 23, 2012 1:27 pm Post subject: |
|
|
I know the MMA fighter has a ton of skills to develop to have a chance in the ring, but the kicking game is one I believe to be most often neglected. I see an awful lot of guys throwing their low roundhouse with no, or very little pivot of the foot, or understanding of how to work them into a combination.
Most kicking in MMA is MT based. So you see the teep (landing to push, not to damage)and the roundhouse 90% of the time. The side kick may be in MT, but I'd be willing to be good money most guys don't develop that aspect enough to bother learning it. Or, they may never be shone because they've been told, contrary to guys like Cung Le proving other wise, that the side kick just can't work in MMA.
There was a recent UFC where one of the fighters used several side kicks to the front of the thigh of his opponent, but I can't for the life of me recall the man's name. It was a free Fox event, so it wasn't someone top tier, and they weren't a MT as striking fighter.
_________________
Kisshu fushin, Oni te hotoke kokoro. A demon's hand, a saint's heart. -- Osensei Shoshin Nagamine |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
bigpopparob2000
Orange Belt
Joined: 23 Jun 2003
Posts: 102
Location: Georgia
Styles: Tae Kwon Do, Gracie Jiu Jitsu
|
| Posted: Sat Jun 23, 2012 3:21 pm Post subject: |
|
|
Thank you for sharing, Kuma. I had seen that video, but I had never notice that Cung Le had used one on Frank's thigh. I suppose I should pay closer attention.
| ShoriKid wrote: |
| Most kicking in MMA is MT based. So you see the teep (landing to push, not to damage)and the roundhouse 90% of the time. The side kick may be in MT, but I'd be willing to be good money most guys don't develop that aspect enough to bother learning it. Or, they may never be shone because they've been told, contrary to guys like Cung Le proving other wise, that the side kick just can't work in MMA. |
Good points, ShoriKid. One of my first instructors told me that the MT roundhouse retains a good portion of its effectiveness even when thrown incorrectly. For example, even if you throw it incorrectly with your leg, your hip is still driving it, or vice versa. As a result, most fighters focus on developing that particular kick, and the side kick is neglected. I think Jose Canseco tried one in his fight against Hong Man Choi, and one of the announcers remarked something like, "that Tae Kwon Do kick isn't going to work," so, like you said, there's certainly some bias against it. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
TravsintheMartialArts
White Belt
Joined: 03 Aug 2012
Posts: 12
Location: New England, USA
Styles: Aikido, Tang Soo Do, Karate, Muay Thai
|
| Posted: Sun Aug 12, 2012 8:30 pm Post subject: |
|
|
I'm glad someone asked this question, because I was getting awfully confused myself. I trained at a Muay Thai/MMA school for about 4 months, and during most of that time refrained from using a lot of kicks I learned in Karate/Tang Soo Do because I wasn't seeing them used. Certainly, the more traditional Muay Thai people never employed much more than thips and round kicks (pretty sure side kicks aren't in the traditional curriculum), but I eventually came up against some MMA fighters there who used a lot of side kicks.
Something tells me side kicks to the leg are probably illegal, but side kicks to the body are okay. I'm in agreement with the idea that most MMA fighters probably aren't training very hard in side kicks; they probably have plenty of other techniques in their arsenal to worry about perfecting. I have always thought side kicks were better used in self defense situations anyway. There may also be some serious bias against using techniques from more traditional styles; because they weren't designed for/successful in a lot of competitive fighting, they seem to be dismissed pretty readily, which I think is a bit of a shame.
_________________
A blog on martial arts training and philosophy, including book reviews, school visits, and training stories:
http://travelsinmartialarts.blogspot.com/ |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
sensei8
KF Sensei
Joined: 23 Feb 2008
Posts: 16430
Location: Las Vegas, NV
Styles: Shindokan Saitou-ryu [Shuri-te/Okinawa-te based]
|
| Posted: Sun Aug 12, 2012 8:37 pm Post subject: |
|
|
I've always gotten a kick out of the rule that prohibits any kick to the knee joint, which I concur with, but any combatant can pop the capsule on an elbow...just makes me giggle.
_________________
**Proof is on the floor!!! |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
madtanker
Orange Belt
Joined: 16 Aug 2012
Posts: 117
Location: Toledo Ohio
Styles: Tang Soo Do/Hapkido
|
| Posted: Sat Aug 18, 2012 8:04 am Post subject: |
|
|
[quote="bigpopparob2000"]*sigh* "waist"
This is what happens when you get old. I completely just lost all my internet credibility, didn't I?
So they are prohibited? Like I said, I didn't find any such rules on the UFC website.[/quote]
I am going to add this to my quotes in a moment, and I remember being taught a version of this but I believe
"The only stupid question is the one that was never asked!!"
Never be afraid to ask, there is someone out here that does not know. I just discussed this with my roomate. She is not doing well in college, and I scored an average 3.93, including pulling a 4.0 in my MBA... and I told her two things
1) Nobody does it without help... I had to bounce concepts off of people that had no idea what I was talking about, but because they let me talk, I worked it out
2) The only stupid question is the one that is not asked!
_________________
It is what you learn when you think you know everything that matters most! (unknown)
" I never saw a wild thing sorry for itself. A small bird will drop frozen dead from a bough without ever having felt sorry for itself". (DH Lawrence)
"The only stupid question is the one that was never asked!!" (Me!!!) |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
madtanker
Orange Belt
Joined: 16 Aug 2012
Posts: 117
Location: Toledo Ohio
Styles: Tang Soo Do/Hapkido
|
| Posted: Sat Aug 18, 2012 8:06 am Post subject: |
|
|
[quote="sensei8"]I've always gotten a kick out of the rule that prohibits any kick to the knee joint, which I concur with, but any combatant can pop the capsule on an elbow...just makes me giggle.
[/quote]
Right... I know that you do not want to disable an opponent in training; however. if you are trainign for it, and someone has invented a move to copy for a reason, you had BETTER try it out somehow. I use boards to train for low kicks... Just junk boards, small enough not to mess me up, but hard enough to know I can do damage if needed.
_________________
It is what you learn when you think you know everything that matters most! (unknown)
" I never saw a wild thing sorry for itself. A small bird will drop frozen dead from a bough without ever having felt sorry for itself". (DH Lawrence)
"The only stupid question is the one that was never asked!!" (Me!!!) |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Romethemighty
White Belt
Joined: 23 Aug 2012
Posts: 9
Styles: Boxing, Jeet Kune Do, MMA
|
| Posted: Thu Aug 23, 2012 1:23 am Post subject: |
|
|
I know I am a noob, but you are all wrong!
I have talked to a few fighters, amateur and professional (although none in the UFC), and all say the same thing!
It is just not acceptable behavior to intentionally end a career. The side kick is well respected by many MMA fighters but is well known to cause injury when launched at the knee (a JKD practioners first thought).
Intentionally disabling another fighter is considered rude and unnacceptable and will usually end in other fighters planning on doing the same to you.
Fighters avoid this for the same reason you don't sneak in a below the belt punch in boxing when the ref isn't looking - it just isn't cool.
_________________
http://www.lethaltouch.com |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
madtanker
Orange Belt
Joined: 16 Aug 2012
Posts: 117
Location: Toledo Ohio
Styles: Tang Soo Do/Hapkido
|
| Posted: Thu Aug 23, 2012 5:06 am Post subject: |
|
|
[quote="Romethemighty"]I know I am a noob, but you are all wrong!
I have talked to a few fighters, amateur and professional (although none in the UFC), and all say the same thing!
It is just not acceptable behavior to intentionally end a career. The side kick is well respected by many MMA fighters but is well known to cause injury when launched at the knee (a JKD practioners first thought).
Intentionally disabling another fighter is considered rude and unnacceptable and will usually end in other fighters planning on doing the same to you.
Fighters avoid this for the same reason you don't sneak in a below the belt punch in boxing when the ref isn't looking - it just isn't cool.[/quote]
I did not know there was an actual rule in MMA; however, I was speaking of the idea that if you know it, someone else does too...
I see the reasoning behind the idea that if you do not fight within the rules that people will expect it, they will look for it, and they will eventually exploit the same weakness...
I have tried to look up/understand the rules of MMA, but I do not train for cage fighting, I tend to lend myself instead to protecting one's self in a street situation.
The bottom line, as we have all so eloquently pointed out: Be prepared for everything; a low blow, a cheap shot, and even someone who knows more. Just because you are honorable does not mean that your opponent is.
_________________
It is what you learn when you think you know everything that matters most! (unknown)
" I never saw a wild thing sorry for itself. A small bird will drop frozen dead from a bough without ever having felt sorry for itself". (DH Lawrence)
"The only stupid question is the one that was never asked!!" (Me!!!) |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Kuma
Black Belt
Joined: 03 Dec 2008
Posts: 1092
|
| Posted: Thu Aug 23, 2012 8:51 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| Romethemighty wrote: |
I know I am a noob, but you are all wrong!
I have talked to a few fighters, amateur and professional (although none in the UFC), and all say the same thing!
It is just not acceptable behavior to intentionally end a career. The side kick is well respected by many MMA fighters but is well known to cause injury when launched at the knee (a JKD practioners first thought).
Intentionally disabling another fighter is considered rude and unnacceptable and will usually end in other fighters planning on doing the same to you.
Fighters avoid this for the same reason you don't sneak in a below the belt punch in boxing when the ref isn't looking - it just isn't cool. |
I don't think anyone on here advocated using a low side kick at the knee of a sparring partner or fellow competitor. The knee is not the only target for a low side kick. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
|
|
on the post.
