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Sasori_Te
Black Belt
Joined: 15 Aug 2003
Posts: 1116
Location: Near Akron Ohio
Styles: Kempo and Kobudo
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 Posted: Fri Dec 19, 2003 10:48 pm Post subject: |
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Drunken Monkey has some valid points. More emphasis needs to be placed on individual performance than on the style of the individual.
I respect these guys as athletes. They train extremely hard to do what they do. I still cannot say that I respect them as martial artists since I don't recognize what they do as martial arts. My opinion.
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A block is a strike is a lock is a throw. |
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SevenStar
Black Belt
Joined: 09 Apr 2003
Posts: 2631
Location: TN
Styles: bjj, judo, shuai chiao, muay thai
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| Posted: Sat Dec 20, 2003 4:19 am Post subject: |
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| Drunken Monkey wrote: |
but what would you take as traditional?
traditional as in chinese loose techniques that you train in kick-boxing style?
traditional chinese shaolin style kung fu with lots of hard physical training and many, many hours of conditioning every day?
traditional as in wing chun where the style was designed to take advantage of the 'traditional' styles?
or are you talking about how traditional styles are taught and practiced today?
sometimes, i really wish people would stop saying things about the arts and instead talk about the people who do the art.
the martial arts that we have now work.
they have all been tested in some situation or another and have thus survived until this day.
the only thing that has changed is how we train.
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That was an excellent post. I think the part I quoted above may have been directed at me though, so I'lll address it:
When I say traditional, I mean traditional - mantis, wing chun, mckwoon...doesn't matter. The reason being that the average non competitive MA doesn't train as hard as a competitive MA. You admit that yourself, to an extent. And you're exactly right - what has changed over time is human work ethic, not the style itself. There are too many distractions today - too many other things to do. Couple that with the fact that nowadays, we aren't training because we live and die on a battlefield and you see why we don't train as hard or with the intent that we assume people trained with back in the day. Sport guys do though, because they live and die in their competition. Beause of that, they train hard, every day. go above and beyond every day.
As for being "tested" we've got no clue whether or not EVERY style that still exists today has been "tested" all we can do is assume and listen to stories... |
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WolverineGuy
Red Belt
Joined: 30 Mar 2003
Posts: 753
Location: Flint, MI
Styles: Kalkinodo, San Chin Ryu, Brazilian Jiu Jitsu, Judo
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| Posted: Sat Dec 20, 2003 8:09 am Post subject: |
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I personally was just disappointed in the SHOW itself. The XMA team is a fantastic example of martial arts. Yes, I just said martial arts. Because when it comes down to it, martial arts over all is about MOVEMENT. These guys have that one mastered. Its the way they apply it that seems to have people down on them, but I have total respect for what they do.
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Wolverine
1st Dan - Kalkinodo
"Shut up brain, or I'll stab you with a q-tip"
"There is no spoon." |
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Drunken Monkey
Black Belt
Joined: 10 Apr 2002
Posts: 3559
Location: bar italia
Styles: white chocolate profiteroles and natas....
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| Posted: Sat Dec 20, 2003 11:06 am Post subject: |
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well, if you look at the 'traditional' styles i mentioned i also gave note of how they used to train as a counter point to how we train.
i truely believe that there is nothing wrong with any style and that your success boils down to how you train.
i mentioned the oldest form of chinese martial art (almost...) of loose technique training which is, in essence, kickboxing.
shaolin is traditional but the original training methods made sure you had the physical strength behind the forms.
wing chun is considered a traditional art but historically, it is very much a modern art that separates the acts of technique training, strength training and sparring.
i've said this before.
those guys have the dedication and drive to push their bodies that far; how hard is it going to be for them to make it work in a fight?
in a way they have already gotten most of the hard work done.
they are strong, flexible, agile and have a huge catalogue of moves in their head.
all that's missing is experience in fighting (and who's to say that they don't spar?)
if they so desired i'm sure thay can strap on some gear and see what works.
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SevenStar
Black Belt
Joined: 09 Apr 2003
Posts: 2631
Location: TN
Styles: bjj, judo, shuai chiao, muay thai
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| Posted: Sat Dec 20, 2003 11:34 am Post subject: |
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| I see what you were saying in that post - problem is, many people involved in those TMA don't train like that anymore. I'm not knocking the style, but the modern day training ethic (or lack thereof) that's associated with them. |
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