Black Belts Taking a Walk

pmh1nic · Yellow Belt

I have observed over the years the tendency of some students who after many years of training and earning their Black Belt leave their school and instructor to venture out into parts unknown.

On the one hand I think this is nature. They've spent maybe five years or more learning a particular art under the guidance of a particular instructor and feel the need to see what else is out there. Yet some instructors consider this an insult and get very upset about it.

I realize getting your Black Belt is just the beginning and there is usually much more to learn in your system, the necessity to fine tune what you already know and a lot to discover about your art through teaching.

I'd like to understand the thinking and feels of those that have experience in this area. Do you feel betrayed if someone you've trained for many years and award a Black Belt to leaves your dojo to see what else is out there.
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"The longer I live the more convincing proofs I see of this truth, that God governs in the affairs of men. And if a sparrow cannot fall to the ground without His notice, is it probable that an empire can rise without His aid?" Benjamin Franklin

WolverineGuy · Red Belt

A lot of times, its kind of like burnout. Most underbelts spend all of their focus and energy trying to achieve black belt that when they get there, they just need a break. Some of them also don't realize the magnitude of what's AFTER first degree black, and its just overwhelming.
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Wolverine
1st Dan - Kalkinodo
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Squawman · Orange Belt

I think it's a good idea to try different styles after you get your black belt because then you can become a well rounded martial artist. One reason that black belts leave a school after their first degree is because there instructor doesn't have an actual curriculum for getting your 2nd degree and so on. Usually what happens in most schools is that once you get your 1st degree the instructor has you teaching more and might fail to actually teach you more. He might see a black belt as a way he can get out of teaching class himself. I would say that if you have 5 black belts or more then you need to make just a black belt class.

delta1 · Black Belt

Everyones path is different. Some want to round out their skills with other arts, others want to go for higher levels of understanding in their present art. Still others think that with the black belt, they've arrived.

I like the approach of some schools that don't give tans/degrees/stripes on the black belt until you've commitedd to staying in the art. You still have your black belt, but it is really just a darker colored belt if you decide to leave. You still have the authority and respect due a black belt in their system, but not the same as someone who stayed with the system.
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aefibird · Black Belt

I think too that some people (especially those from 'belt factories') think that getting a black belt is the end of the road and there's no need to continue with training anymore, which is a pity.
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John G · Green Belt

I may have read your post wrong, but if your asking as an instructor do we get upset or disappointed when a student leaves, I guess that depends on the circumstances.

If your student achieves the level of black belt and leaves the next day without a word, sure I would be upset. Not for what the student has done, but for what I have or haven't done.

If your student comes up to you and says "Thank you for what you have taught me however I would like to explore other arts". I would understand.

If a student says "Your crappy, I'm going to train under another instructor and or art", Well what would you say...

Respectfully,
_________________
John G Jarrett

III Dan, ITF Taekwon-Do

pmh1nic · Yellow Belt

John G

I think some students are reluctant to approach their sensei and say "I'm leaving" regardless of the reason because they believe it can't help but be interpreted as an insult. This may be especially true if the instructor has said over the years that there is nothing much out there worth learning that he can't teach the student. In some cases I've heard instructors talk down a student that has left for whatever the reason. This makes it less likely that a student who is thinking about leaving wants to open themself up to a barge of negativity about leaving the school.

In one sense I think the instructor has to view the relationship with his students in the same way (loosely speaking

) as you view a romantic relationship. The harder you try to hold onto a person the more they are inclined to leave. Some instructors will either talk down other schools/systems, constantly talk up their own school/system to the point of hyperbole or even put in the contract a clause that if you leave the school within x number of years of receiving your Black Belt you won't be recognized by the school or federation that issued the rank.

This type of situation can be the result of pride, concerns over the financial loss of losing a student, legitimate concerns about the students progress in the martial arts or a combination of all three.

My attitude is I'll give you the best I can and if you feel the need to search for something more go with my blessing. I think instructors need to communicate that a student's decision to leave is not going to be necessarily viewed as an insult and if they in fact leave the school they welcomed back with open arms.
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"The longer I live the more convincing proofs I see of this truth, that God governs in the affairs of men. And if a sparrow cannot fall to the ground without His notice, is it probable that an empire can rise without His aid?" Benjamin Franklin

monkeygirl · KF VIP

Some schools don't have a very good blackbelt program. My school, for example: once you reached 1st dan, you learned a new kata, and that was it. No new techniques, nothing. You were just supposed to improve on previous techniques for two or three years before you could test for 2nd dan. And the cycle continued: new kata, improve on old techniques. The worst part about it: my instructor couldn't remember the 2nd dan kata.

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1st dan & Asst. Instructor TKD 2000-2003

No matter the tune...if you can rock it, rock it hard.

CloudDragon · Purple Belt

I agree with monkeygirl. Many schools don't offer much after 1st Dan. You usually get stuck in a teaching position and get taught new technques here and there as the head instructor finds time.
This does not apply to all schools, but where I find it most is when you have schools with few black belts but a large enrollment of colored belts (like 20 or 30 colored belts to every black belt). These schools seem to focus attention on getting the colored belts ready for the next test. What instructors don't realize is that they are pushing their students to new belt levels every 2 or 3 months, and then wondering why they leave after 1st Dan and find out that they have to wait 2 years for their next promotion. Insturctors need to realize that students get accustomed to learning material quickly, but not thoroughly, and they see this as the martial arts, then 2 or 3 years into training they get 1st Dan and their entire learning process and mindset must be changed, this leaves the student disoriented and wondering about the validity of their martial art.
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A Black Belt is just a white belt that don't know when to quit!

Sasori_Te · Black Belt

If they have an instructor like this they need to be wondering about the validity of their martial art.
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