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kle1n
Green Belt
Joined: 07 Feb 2003
Posts: 402
Location: Cologne, Germany
Styles: Wing Chun, Jeet Kune Do
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 Posted: Sun Oct 19, 2003 5:43 pm Post subject: :D |
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i had the same rush which made me fight worse too. but there is a answer: u need more fighting experience in real life and u need to be successfull and then it leaves. the problem with me is that i hardly defend myself verbaly. and thats why people take the * of me alot cause i am too friendly. but when they try to hit me they get a beating. this may sound like an exscuse for me for beeing in to much fights but thats the reason ppl think they can mess with me.
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Be everything. Be nothing. |
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BladeLee
Orange Belt
Joined: 20 Jul 2002
Posts: 225
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| Posted: Sun Oct 19, 2003 6:35 pm Post subject: |
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Sounds good to me kle1n. I have alot of fighting experience, but not like, street fighting. Aside from sparring in class, I do have this thing called 'fight night' where me and alot of friends get together like twice a year and pretty much beat the hell out of each other, either boxing sparring or grappling. But besides that, i dont have the real experience and thast what i need. Now just to reinforce what i said before..im not looking for a fight...im not an *, but at the same time why should i always walk away? Especially if someone touches me aggresively. Now maybe purposely putting myself in these situations is wrong, but why? If it is with these druggies, these assholes, these abusers, and just myself, then what is the problem? All im saying is i'm not going to walk away from THOSE people next time, people like that need taught a lesson anyhow. I'm completely for walking away most of the time and not starting fights, but there is a time and place for everything. I MUST get rid of this feeling.. In the mean time, im going to start real fight training like once a week again too. Just me a a random friend out of a few, who pretty much try out techiniques full force and go at it a bit. Thats about as friendly for real combat as i think i can get to solve my problem.
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~BladeLee~ |
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Shorinryu Sensei
Black Belt
Joined: 13 Jun 2002
Posts: 2045
Location: Kalispell, Montana
Styles: Shorinryu Matsumura Kenpo (Seito/Orthodox) Karate and Kobudo
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| Posted: Sun Oct 19, 2003 6:47 pm Post subject: |
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To be honest with you, I don't know of any way to control an adrenaline rush, other than to start doing a few hundred jumping jacks (always intimidating to do in front of an opponent before you fight him  ) or a hundred pushups.
The dumping of adrenaline into the system is natures way of "pumping you up" for a stressful situation.
I think time, experience and confidence in your abilities will help, because you won't get so "shaken" in a stressful situation and your mind will react differently than it does now.
Fighting, especially if you're training in a TMA, isn't really a desirable quality in todays society, and you've stressed several times that "fighting is my life". Maybe you need to consider going into more of a full contact system, like boxing, instead of the martial arts. Get that fighting urge out of your system, especially the first time you get dropped by a guy with a lot more experience, or a newbie with a lucky shot. |
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delta1
Black Belt
Joined: 17 Feb 2003
Posts: 1780
Location: North Central Washington
Styles: It's ALL Kenpo! Bring it back to base!
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| Posted: Sun Oct 19, 2003 6:48 pm Post subject: |
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| Shorinryu Sensei wrote: |
| Whoa...sorry, but I have to disagree with delta1 on this. |
No problem! A little disagreement from time to time keeps the forum interesting.
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| Purposely getting into fights to learn to control adrenaline rush? There should be no way that a martial artist should intentionaly get into ANY fight, in my opinion. |
Note that I did not advocate just going out and getting into street fights to learn to deal with the adrenalin rush. However, there ARE times when a martial artist either can not or should not back down. Ex: when you are reasonably sure the problem will only escalate with time, or your backing down will encourage the opponent to escalate the threat. Another ex: my son, a martial artist, steped in to stop another kid from physically harrassing a disabled boy. First time a warning, second time he planted the butt-head. I normally don't tolerate my kids starting fights at school, but that time I told him I'd back him all the way. Fortunately it wasn't necessary; I talked with the Principal and he agreed.
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| Also where you ahve people in yoyur dojo call yo unames, toss stujff at you, hit on yoru girlfriend??? You actually think that's going to get you mad, when you'll know exactly what they are doing? I can see it making you laugh like hell, but get you mad? No, I can't see that happening. |
It won't allways make you mad, but it will distract, disorient, and definately make you nervouse. Just like sparing in class will never exactly duplicate a street fight, niether will this. We do the best we can to simulate. But to directly deal with your point, if the other class mates can't make you at least a little angry, send them over and I'll introduce them to some of these ****heads here! But come on, most of the Montanans I've hung around with specialize in p.o.'ing just about anyone they meet, then getting them too drunk to remember they are mad!
And if you don't think the House of Horrors will make you nervouse and a little scared, this is the perfect time of year to try it out. Give it a try!
The 'hit on your girlfriend' comment was a (facetios, faciouse, facishous)... funny way of saying just about anything goes.
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| I do agree that frequent sparring, especially controlled full contact, will help a lot to get you to learn control. Getting smacked a few times and getting angry certainly will work. |
Learn to control that anger, Grasshopper. 
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| "Cato drills"? Again, when you're expecting it in class, there will be no adrenaline rush associated with it, because you are expecting it. It's no surprise when you walk in the door of the dojo and expect to be attacked at any time, and you know it. |
Maybe not like on the street, but you'll get it.
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| What causes the "rush" is the fact that it's NOT expected..sudden and potentially explosive. |
Again, we do the best we can. You do make some good points, but short of going to biker bars and making disparaging remarks about Harly's (which neither of us advocates), what do you suggest?
Getting jumped by someone bigger and meaner than me, even in class when I expect it, scares me and makes me nervouse. Same thing on the street scares me more. Most schools do spontaneity drills to deal with sudden attacks, and the 'Cato Drill' is just another type of spontaniety drill. Same with the H of H. Also, many times you WILL know an assault is comeing. Did you know that if you can describe your opponents attitude and actions such that you portray an immenent assault, you probably are (in most places) legally within your rights to launch a pre-emptive strike? (warning- I am armed with a self help law book for martial artists, and if pushed I'm not afraid to use it! I am, however, too lazy to run out and get it right now. References on demand ok? ) So these drills are not all that far from reality. |
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BladeLee
Orange Belt
Joined: 20 Jul 2002
Posts: 225
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| Posted: Sun Oct 19, 2003 7:17 pm Post subject: |
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"The dumping of adrenaline into the system is natures way of "pumping you up" for a stressful situation. "
True, but in any other situation the adrenaline helps me out, gives me a good boost  And i know adrenaline can either work with you, or against you. I know its working against me in this case and im not sure why and ive already described everything so ill refrain from doing that again 
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Shorinryu Sensei
Black Belt
Joined: 13 Jun 2002
Posts: 2045
Location: Kalispell, Montana
Styles: Shorinryu Matsumura Kenpo (Seito/Orthodox) Karate and Kobudo
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| Posted: Sun Oct 19, 2003 7:20 pm Post subject: |
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Geeze,,,I really need to slow down when I type and correct those typos! Sorry people! 
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| However, there ARE times when a martial artist either can not or should not back down. |
Absolutly!
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| But to directly deal with your point, if the other class mates can't make you at least a little angry, send them over and I'll introduce them to some of these ****heads here! But come on, most of the Montanans I've hung around with specialize in p.o.'ing just about anyone they meet, then getting them too drunk to remember they are mad! |
Obviously, you HAVE met some Montanans! lol  Although I'm not the type that goes around po'ing people on a regular basis. I must be an exception to the "Montana Rule"? 
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| And if you don't think the House of Horrors will make you nervouse and a little scared, this is the perfect time of year to try it out. Give it a try! |
House of horrors???
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| Again, we do the best we can. You do make some good points, but short of going to biker bars and making disparaging remarks about Harly's (which neither of us advocates), what do you suggest? |
Well, we can ride my Yamaha to a Harley bar and park it out front. Just don't go in!!!  The only suggestion I would have is to take up boxing. A sport where you probably get tagged nightly, and often.
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| Getting jumped by someone bigger and meaner than me, even in class when I expect it, scares me and makes me nervouse. |
That's my problem..there's nobody in class bigger, or meaner than me!
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| Did you know that if you can describe your opponents attitude and actions such that you portray an immenent assault, you probably are (in most places) legally within your rights to launch a pre-emptive strike? |
Yep..I knew that. Montana statue says...
45-3-102. Use of force in defense of person. A person is justified in the use of force or threat to use force against another when and to the extent that he reasonably believes that such conduct is necessary to defend himself or another against such other's imminent use of unlawful force. However, he is justified in the use of force likely to cause death or serious bodily harm only if he reasonably believes that such force is necessary to prevent imminent death or serious bodily harm to himself or another or to prevent the commission of a forcible felony.
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| (warning- I am armed with a self help law book for martial artists, and if pushed I'm not afraid to use it! I am, however, too lazy to run out and get it right now. References on demand ok? |
Naw, that takes to long. I just carry a bunch of my lawyers business cards in my shirt pocket and in an attack situation  , I assume a mean looking stance, snap one of those cards out at lightning speed (practice the move nightly) and tell them.."This is my lawyer, and I'm prepared to SUE!"  |
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delta1
Black Belt
Joined: 17 Feb 2003
Posts: 1780
Location: North Central Washington
Styles: It's ALL Kenpo! Bring it back to base!
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| Posted: Sun Oct 19, 2003 8:10 pm Post subject: |
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| Shorinryu Sensei wrote: |
| Obviously, you HAVE met some Montanans! lol Although I'm not the type that goes around po'ing people on a regular basis. I must be an exception to the "Montana Rule"? |
Oh yeah!!! We'd have to start a whole nuther forum just to talk about 'em! But I don't believe you're an angel...
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| I just carry a bunch of my lawyers business cards in my shirt pocket and in an attack situation , I assume a mean looking stance, snap one of those cards out at lightning speed (practice the move nightly) and tell them.."This is my lawyer, and I'm prepared to SUE!" |
Now that's mean- one bad az mudder!
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| House of horrors??? |
Yup. Take a building- anything with rooms and objects inside large enough to hide behind- and turn down the lights. Stock it well with well padded assailants. Pad yourself up good, then go look inside. Ground is an option, weapons are likely, safety first, but everything after that is a little iffy! (Just kidding ) If the occupants are hittin' like they should, you'll be just a little bit on the skittish side. And if they are really good, and someone hides better than you search, and he yells really loud just as he lands on you, I promise you'll get a chance to work on tameing the adrenal monster! You'll also have to clean your ghi, but that's a small price to pay for such valueable training, wouldn't you say?
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Well, we can ride my Yamaha to a Harley bar and park it out front. Just don't go in!!! The only suggestion I would have is to take up boxing. A sport where you probably get tagged nightly, and often.
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You do realize that rideing a Japanese bike is like..., oh wait, this is a clean forum- dang, just use your immagination. The punch line is "It feels good untill somebody sees you!"
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| That's my problem..there's nobody in class bigger, or meaner than me! |
Lucky you!
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Yep..I knew that. Montana statue says...
45-3-102. Use of force in defense of person. A person is justified in the use of force or threat to use force against another when and to the extent that he reasonably believes that such conduct is necessary to defend himself or another against such other's imminent use of unlawful force. However, he is justified in the use of force likely to cause death or serious bodily harm only if he reasonably believes that such force is necessary to prevent imminent death or serious bodily harm to himself or another or to prevent the commission of a forcible felony. |
OK, smart alleck! I'm duely one upped! Now you'll probably have a big head and be insufferable for a while!
Any how, I do agree with you about not getting into real fights when you don't have to. But sometimes this 'just run away' stuff gets a little out of hand. There are times. And if some real jerk is willing to help out with your reality training, and you are willing to take the risks,... . And since the subject came up, one of the risks you take is with the law. Right or wrong, you probably will go to jail, and you will have to explain why you did everything you did before, dureing and after the fight. A good trick is to preface all those good reasons you have for stomping him with the phrase "Your Honor, I did it because...". |
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delta1
Black Belt
Joined: 17 Feb 2003
Posts: 1780
Location: North Central Washington
Styles: It's ALL Kenpo! Bring it back to base!
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| Posted: Sun Oct 19, 2003 8:35 pm Post subject: |
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| BladeLee wrote: |
"The dumping of adrenaline into the system is natures way of "pumping you up" for a stressful situation. "
True, but in any other situation the adrenaline helps me out, gives me a good boost And i know adrenaline can either work with you, or against you. I know its working against me in this case and im not sure why and ive already described everything so ill refrain from doing that again |
Don't feel alone! We've all experienced that.
One reason it works against you in a fight is the percieved threat of harm. You know you are possibly going to get hurt, and you feel like you are moving too slow to stop it, so you watch it happen with some kind of morbid fascination. Just realize that you feel you are moving slow, but you are actually moving like greased lightning! Also, realize that he feels the same way.
Another thing that might bother you, and it is oddly enough my worst fear, and that is the fear of failure. Getting hit is not the terror for me, but not at least getting some good hits in myself scares me into a pathetic, immobile stump. I deal with it by telling myself repeatedly that the worst thing I can do is nothing. In a way, I guess I'm lucky because sparing is sort of like reality to me- I have to face the same fear on the mat.
You know, I should charge for all this advise. But in order to do that, I first have to use some big words. So, here goes: the term for that feeling you get when everything seems to go in slow motion in an emergency, is TACHI-PSYCHE. Tachi is to speed up, and psyche of course deals with your thought process. But if you think you are moving slow, why don't we call it bradipsyche (slow thought)? Well, that is because your mind speeds up to the point that fast seems slow to you. This is a good thing in a fight because you are able to percieve things in time to counter his threats.
OK, you all can make your checks payable to  . |
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Goju1
Blue Belt
Joined: 04 Jul 2003
Posts: 266
Location: Coronado CA
Styles: IOGKF Goju Ryu
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| Posted: Sun Oct 19, 2003 9:43 pm Post subject: |
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Blade Lee -
a) don't go where these people are, period!
b) you sound really young, maybe take a few years and mellow out?
c) but if you ever find yourself in a position like you've mentioned and you are sufficiently well-trained, your instincts will take over, don't worry about it! |
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cross
Black Belt
Joined: 22 Jan 2003
Posts: 1904
Location: Australia
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| Posted: Mon Oct 20, 2003 12:22 am Post subject: |
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| Now im not being egotiscal or anything, but I can pretty much kick anyones * 1v1, and to be honest im pretty confident fighting much more than that. |
Of coarse your not |
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on the post.
