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koreantiger81
Blue Belt
Joined: 13 Dec 2001
Posts: 283
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 Posted: Wed Mar 20, 2002 12:37 am Post subject: |
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After many years of studying tae kwon do, I found out that my school is not officially I.T.F certified. (Although my master claimed that it was certified.)
I studied under the Jhoon Ree system of Tae Kwon do, which is supposed to be affliated with the I.T.F system of tae kwon do. The patterns are the same, the kicks are the same, but the development of power using the so called "sine technique" differentiates Jhoon ree's system of tae kwon do from the I.T.F tae kwon do system.
After talking to an I.T.F master, he claimed that Jhoon Ree's system of tae kwon do is not officially I.T.F certified. My intentions are to to learn more, so I don't mind if I have to lose my black belt. It's just a little dissappointing after studying "Jhoon Rhee's" system of tae kwon do for 10 years, that my belt is not recognized in other I.T.F schools. What are your thoughts on my situation? Is there some truth to this? Also, how do I find out if a school is really certified? |
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Bretty101
Green Belt
Joined: 14 Feb 2002
Posts: 458
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| Posted: Wed Mar 20, 2002 7:07 am Post subject: |
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You'll always be a black belt in Taekwondo no one will ever take that away from you.
I've been with 3 different TKD organisations and they all claim to not recognise each others grades yet they all use to be unified.
It's BŁ"^%"IT! and politics and the down fall of the martial arts world. You'll find it's more down to the instructor then the organisation. so don't worry about it. Most will let you train with them and just make you sign up to the new organisatin (license, membership, etc) and if you want to continue on with the next grade you may have to retake your last one.
I'd personally tell them to...i'll go train somewhere else.
Official ITF What a joke!!!
Bretty |
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Chris from CT
Orange Belt
Joined: 23 Sep 2001
Posts: 168
Location: Connecticut, USA
Styles: Jung Ki Hapkido, Shaolin Kempo
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| Posted: Wed Mar 20, 2002 7:15 am Post subject: |
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I'm sure this may irritate some people, but this is not my intention.
Who is your hero in the martial arts? And I mean your absolute favorite! Then, pretend that you trained with him/her for as long as you trained with your current instructor and you earned rank trough them.
Now pretend that your favorite martial artist isn't certified by anyone. No one even acknowledges that person as a martial artist.
How would you feel?
Don't loose hope yet.  Does this make your training worthless? I wouldn't say so. Many great martial artists are unknown and not affiliated with an organization. As long as you feel like you have bettered yourself I would say... SCORE!
What is certification? Someone who in writing or verbally backs you up and says," Yes, he/she is a black belt."? If you ever had to defend yourself, a certificate that says your a black belt is no extra bonus to get your butt safely out of there. You depend on your training to do that. Even if the toughest person on the face of the earth says, "yeah he's a black belt" doesn't make you any tougher. It may frighten a person or two, but honestly you are no different and no tougher. People say, "oh well we have standardized ranking procedures." That's great, but not all teachers are the same caliber. Just because you are a great martial artist doesn't make you a great teacher. Take two people of the same rank in an organization from two different teachers and their skill will be different. So ask yourself, is your training good? What do you think of your instructor?
Hey, being certified isn't a bad thing, but I would put training first. If you really want to be "certified" you can always join an organization and test through them.
Bottom line: A teacher is teaching you not an entire organiziation. If you respect your teacher you respect the whole.
Just my honest opinion.
Take care
_________________
Chris LaCava
"Man is born soft and supple,
in death he is hard and rigid..." LaoTzu
[ This Message was edited by: Chris from CT on 2002-03-20 08:20 ] |
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SBN Doug
KF VIP
Joined: 04 Nov 2001
Posts: 3767
Location: Houston, TX
Styles: Kuk Sool Won
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| Posted: Wed Mar 20, 2002 7:23 am Post subject: |
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I don't know why you would think that would irritate. I thought it was well put, and to a certain extent I agree.
However, there's the other side of the spectrum where Karate Joe opens a school where he trains you from what he learned exclusively from a mail order course. And, someone completely new to the MAs won't know him from a good instuctor without some sort of affiliation to at least attempt to show legitimacy. |
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KickChick
Black Belt
Joined: 02 Aug 2001
Posts: 3282
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| Posted: Wed Mar 20, 2002 7:24 am Post subject: |
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There are so many associations and unions involved in BOTH ITF and WTF ... lets not concentrate on just one division. Our school happens to be certified by USTA which happens to be a non-profit professional orgranization which aids in the development and progression of TKD both as an art and a sport. These orgainzations (some I am sure do profit) provide professional guidance in setting up and managing national standards of practice and competition, providing training, testing, and accreditation for both individual members and school members. The USTA just happens to be an active member of the World Taekwondo Federation ...although we are an ITF school  ... but many students in years past were interested in the possiblity of pursuing the Olympics so thew school had to be certified as such.
The politics involved makes your head spin ... I tend not to dwell on all this but unfortunately you will run into it when you go to tournament such as I have this week. I was to go to tournament this weekend but unfortunately the school learned that we had to be members of the USTU because this tournament was sanctioned by them. I bowed out .... I was not willing to hand out an additional 40 dollars (mind you each particiapant from our school would have to pay this) plus the 40.00 fee for one event and 10.00 for each addtional. No trophies were being awarded so where was all that $ being spent on????
If you truly have concerns I suggest you contact the ITF http://www.itf-information.com/
... but YOU will know that you will always be a black belt.
_________________
KarateForums Sensei
1st dan BlackBelt TKD(ITF)
CardioKickboxing/Fitness Inst.
[ This Message was edited by: KickChick on 2002-03-20 08:26 ] |
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Chris from CT
Orange Belt
Joined: 23 Sep 2001
Posts: 168
Location: Connecticut, USA
Styles: Jung Ki Hapkido, Shaolin Kempo
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| Posted: Wed Mar 20, 2002 7:51 am Post subject: |
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On 2002-03-20 08:23, KSN Doug wrote:
However, there's the other side of the spectrum where Karate Joe opens a school where he trains you from what he learned exclusively from a mail order course. And, someone completely new to the MAs won't know him from a good instuctor without some sort of affiliation to at least attempt to show legitimacy.
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That's a good point, Doug and I agree. The only reason I wouldn't, in this situation, is Koreantiger has spent years with his instructor and during that time must have had outside contact with other martial artists and there by evaluating what he has learned to that of others. If he hasn't, I'll just shut up. 
Take care
_________________
Chris LaCava
Jung Ki Kwan of Connecticut
"Man is born soft and supple,
in death he is hard and rigid..." LaoTzu |
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TKD_McGee
Purple Belt
Joined: 02 Oct 2001
Posts: 594
Location: Washington
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| Posted: Wed Mar 20, 2002 9:32 pm Post subject: |
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You worked so hard for it, at least you think your a black belt in your mind. Just because your master did not have a qualification from a club (ITF) dosen't mean much..
Well that sounded dumb.. As long as you have the concepts down... you can always get a black belt at wal mart.
_________________
Do unto others, as they done to you. |
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Prodigy-Child
Green Belt
Joined: 02 Jul 2001
Posts: 458
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| Posted: Thu Mar 21, 2002 5:05 am Post subject: |
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that is one problem with taekwondo sactions..........there is so damn many of them that you cannot be recognized for your rank if you move to another do jang........
they should have first taken a look at your skills and stuff and detirmine whether you were a real black belt......
we just started a judo program at our dojo and a few kids of this one father went to a tournament.....the kids father is a black belt in judo.....so that helped a bit......the kids were blue belts in jiu jitsu and after goign to the judo tournament the senior officials watched them fight and gave them a orange belt based on their fighting skills |
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three60roundhouse
Pre-Black Belt
Joined: 10 Jan 2002
Posts: 891
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| Posted: Thu Mar 21, 2002 12:17 pm Post subject: |
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| At our school, when a new student comes to our dojang and has previously studied, he gets evaluated by the head instructors and if he has ANY knowledge, they will wither let him keep that rank or give him a lower one. That way training isn't lost, but the new student has to have many more lessons in the beginning to learn what we do differently and to learn our patters. They all catch up, eventually. |
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SaiFightsMS
KF VIP
Joined: 28 Oct 2001
Posts: 6397
Location: Ohio
Styles: Shotokan, Shorin Ryu, Shi-to Ryu
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| Posted: Mon Mar 25, 2002 1:17 pm Post subject: |
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First class after a test one time I was riding to class with sensei. Seems he had "lost" his black belt. Had no idea at all where it was. It finally turned up. Someone who was helping put things up afterward had somehow put in in a boxfull of sparring gear.
There is more than one way to loose a belt.
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on the post.
