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Adonnis
White Belt
White Belt

Joined: 26 Jan 2002
Posts: 7


PostPosted: Tue Jan 29, 2002 1:01 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

At the present moment a black belt can decide to open his new dojo without any prior experience. Is this a good thing ... No! I am aware of a course for instructors thought with diploma at the end. Where your now are of recognised ability to teach Karate. THIS IS WHAT ALL TEACHERS SHOULD HAVE.
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jamie
White Belt
White Belt

Joined: 08 Jan 2002
Posts: 11


PostPosted: Tue Jan 29, 2002 6:53 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

A good black belt does not a good teacher make,i always thought ,rightly or wrongly that the individual interpretation of ones art begins when you not only reach this grade but developing the art to maximise your strenghts and minimise your weakness.
Ultimatly if he/she crap then he/she will have no students i the long term
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AnonymousOne
Red Belt
Red Belt

Joined: 27 Jan 2002
Posts: 812


PostPosted: Tue Jan 29, 2002 8:01 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Should a medical student be allowed to perform brain surgery?

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7th Dan Chidokai

A true combat warrior has to be hard as nails in mind, body and soul. Warriors are action takers and not action fakers. If you are cruising, make time for losing
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Tobias_Reece
Brown Belt
Brown Belt

Joined: 26 May 2001
Posts: 691
Location: Leeds, England
Styles: Matayoshi Okinawawn Kobudo, Shotokan Karate

PostPosted: Wed Jan 30, 2002 9:52 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

All of my students and coaches have to have gained their instructors qualification before they are entered for their black belt grading.

This may eliminate the problem of black belts doing crap instruction. We hope...... LOL

C ya



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"You Are Never Given A Dream Without Also Being Given The Power To Make It True. You May Have To Work For It, However"

Principal Kobudo Instructor & Owner
West Yorkshire Kobudo Academy
2nd Kyu (Matayoshi Okinawan Kobudo, IOKA UK)
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three60roundhouse
Pre-Black Belt
Pre-Black Belt

Joined: 10 Jan 2002
Posts: 891


PostPosted: Wed Jan 30, 2002 11:12 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Well, here is a startling yet tru scenario.

Hmm....you visit century martial arts or any other martial arts supply store and buy a solid black belt, or even an embroidered one ! Then, you buy a certificate that says, "Joe Shmoe, Black Belt in Karate, signed Master Blah Blah Blah (forged signature). Then, you find a good deal on leasing a building, a room, or hold classes in a basement, whatever. You make a lot of money, when really you just started and only are a white belt .

Sad, but true.
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Iron Arahat
Red Belt
Red Belt

Joined: 08 Aug 2001
Posts: 846
Location: Canada

PostPosted: Wed Jan 30, 2002 11:26 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Seeing that in some system I have heard that it takes less than three years to obtain a black belt, I would say the answer should be "no".

Some countries have government regulated laws to deal with this issue.

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AnonymousOne
Red Belt
Red Belt

Joined: 27 Jan 2002
Posts: 812


PostPosted: Wed Jan 30, 2002 12:54 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I would definately like to see government regulation to control this.

Here in New Zealand we have no such control.

The amount of time training is not the only factor that determines skill. Its also the type of training and the intensity of training.

Our school requires you to have been training about 3 years for Shodan grade. The training is intense and hard and the grading standards are tough. I have seen whole gradings fail. What I mean is I have seen 40 people all fail at once. This is a tough stance to take, but down here the school I am in is very concerned abouts its reputation.


To Nidan grade is 3 years after Shodan.

To Sandan grade is 4 years after Nidan.

Then another 4 years to Yondan

Then a further 4 or 5 to Godan.

So getting to 5th Dan takes about 20 years.

We have a policy that no one under Sandan can teach. In other words they must have been training at least 10 years. They must also hold a medical/first aid cert. They also must have received advanced training in Japan. Getting to teach in our school is no easy task. The rules are strict and training intense as it should be.

Our country also has its fair share of charlatans. When I started some 27 odd years ago, there were very few schools and one had little choice. Today, sadly, martial art schools are dime a dozen. There are hundreds of them. I still say there are only 4 decent schools. Shotokan, Chidokan, Shorin-Ryu and Gojuryu. The rest have poor standards, poorly trained and incompetant teachers.

I know a young man that was recently given Sandan by his school and he is 17. His technique is only as good as our 1st Kyu's at best.

Some schools have weird policies. They say you must have been training for at least 5 years. But ... if you have Shodan from another school and are up to standard they will allow you to resit Shodan immediately. So you can go to one school and get Shodan in 3 years and change schools and circumvent waiting 5 years.





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A true combat warrior has to be hard as nails in mind, body and soul. Warriors are action takers and not action fakers. If you are cruising, make time for losing
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KickChick
Black Belt
Black Belt

Joined: 02 Aug 2001
Posts: 3282


PostPosted: Wed Jan 30, 2002 7:21 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

.... so might I continue our discussion on the necessity of a belt here? One would need to have such a "dan/degree" would one not in order to instruct? So hmmm I'm confused. How many people would take instruction from someone without a belt, from someone they do not know. The would-be student cannot tell exactly what "skill" is yet because they have not studied the style.
If I were studying a trade I would after all my hard work and effort be granted a certification ... a personal attainment and accomplishment if anything of my skill. To be hired I would then need this certification to prove I've mastered all the material. One does not get a black belt if they are not truly skilled up to a certain point in their style. It's like educational degrees --an associates degree...then bachelors, masters, doctors etc.
At least that is how I view it.
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AnonymousOne
Red Belt
Red Belt

Joined: 27 Jan 2002
Posts: 812


PostPosted: Wed Jan 30, 2002 7:55 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

The ranking system has a good and bad side. Unfortunately it really doesnt show real skill by someones words.

You get earn a black belt over the net and get a cert without ever having done much, in other words you buy it. That is no protection for the general public.

On the other hand their are some protection systems in place. For example one can show that the cert is authoried by the World Karate Union and the school has recognition by the Japanese Ministry of Education. Personally outside of this I wouldnt look at a school.

As for Chinese and Korean Martial Arts thats a whole another difficulty for me anyway because I dont keep up with whos who.

In the old days in Okinawa your grade was being able to advance to the next Kata it was simple.

Its a difficult issue. Some people may not be astute enough to check the school out. Fortunately I was. And what I saw deeply impressed me and still does.










[ This Message was edited by: AnonymousOne on 2002-01-30 20:58 ]
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KickChick
Black Belt
Black Belt

Joined: 02 Aug 2001
Posts: 3282


PostPosted: Thu Jan 31, 2002 5:34 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Because of the different organizations within Taekwondo , choosing a dojang may be complicated, especially for prospective students. But compared to most martial arts, TKD is remarkably unified and well-structured. In roughly the same amount of time it took Taekkyon to become TKD and split into two styles, Shaolin Kung-fu evolved into as many as 1,500 different styles. Students must research the different organizations and choose one that best fits their needs and to be sure that there is an accrediting body that oversees the functioning of the school. In the U.S. this is customary. Our school was affiliated with the USTA. The USTA had an international branch, the International Taekwondo Alliance (ITA), to serve its schools outside the United States. With the increased expansion of its international schools, in 2000 the USTA changed its emphasis to being an international rather than a national organization. It dropped its USTA designation and is now officially known as the ITA. The ITA is an independent rank accrediting body that operates separately from, but oversees, the functioning of its individual Taekwondo Plus centers, ITA academies, and clubs. It provides licensing, certification, and curriculum development services to instructors and students and develops guidelines, rank positions, standards, and instructional curriculum for its academies


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