MMA vs. Reality

aznkarateboi · Brown Belt

read this: http://mizzoumartialarts.bizland.com/reality.chtml
I thought it was interesting

JohnnyS · Green Belt

Sounds like he's bitter and looking for excuses. If he could so easily defeat a Gracie or any grappler using "vital point strikes", then why doesn't he enter a competition and try it? Why would NHB fighters ignore these so-called "vital point strikes"? Perhaps because ehy know that they don't work against someone who is motivated and doesn't mind a little bit of pain.
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BJJ - Black Belt under John Will (Machado)
Shootfighting - 3rd Degree Black Belt
TKD - Black Belt

JohnnyS · Green Belt

And another thing: Why do people think "reality" is the front-yard of some redneck's trailer-park home e.g. Old washing machines, cinder blocks etc, beer bottles etc?

You'd think from reading the posts by people who are against grappling that everywhere you go the ground is strewn with broken glass, bottles and used syringes. Think about if for a second anyway, in a fight between a grappler and striker, who's going to end up on their back if the fight goes to the ground ?
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BJJ - Black Belt under John Will (Machado)
Shootfighting - 3rd Degree Black Belt
TKD - Black Belt

AndrewGreen · Pre-Black Belt

"If you want reality, start by taking the padding off the fence. Now make sure that the sharp ends are sticking up above the top rail, and that the top rail is chest to throat level and some is torn off the post. A little barb wire on top helps the reality too. Now cut off most of the lights and throw a bunch of cinderblocks, gravel, broken bottles, boards and discarded television sets into the ring. An old washing machine or refrigerator laying on its side, or a junk car with parts laying all over the place would be a nice touch. And my personal favorite was always an old rusty set of bedsprings that you could barely see in the dark "

He's a nut. It's that simple.

"During the match, I was surprised at the number of available targets on Gracie that the "striker" did not attack."

Sure makes it sound easy to beat Royce though...
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Andrew Green
http://innovativema.ca - All the top martial arts news!

Warp Spider · Brown Belt

Because real fights don't break out in the middle of a field with padding everywhere and both opponents facing each other. Most environments where you are lightly to get into a fight are loaded with weapons or environmental features that can be used in a fight. In the UFC you are not permitted to wear cleats or steel-toed boots. Eye gouges and biting are not allowed. Biting, especially, is something most grappling styles leave themselves totally open to. In a real fight there is almost always several things that can be improvised as a weapon, even if it's as simple as a rock on the ground. A person may not be able to make much of a swing if you've got them pinned down, but if they've got a rock in their hand it will still pack a wallop.

There's also changes in elevation, and the takedown is much more effective than the fight that follows. I'd rather have someone try to choke me on the ground than have that same person deliver a piledriver on pavement. If you get in a fight "on the street," there are often cars around. Sometimes moving ones that you could throw a person into the path of. That's certainately an option you don't have on the ground. If the other person has a concealed weapon and you go to the ground, chances are you'll find it buried 4 inches into your back.

A good grappler can take a poor striker to the ground easily. A good striker can deliver a knockout strike when a poor grappler makes that same attempt. If they are of roughly equal ability, it's a toss-up.

The UFC is not realistic because the real world is not padded, not level, and not constrained to a small octagon. Weapons are plentiful and varied. The attack may come from anywhere at any time. It could be nearly pitch black out, you could be choked by someone's chain necklace. Getting punched by a guy with a huge ring on makes a mess. There are no weight classes in real fights.

The end results of fights in the UFC, like that article states, are very different than in real life. I don't mean to bash grappling, but the fact is, not all fights go to the ground, and grappling can backfire. There's a move called a curb-stomp that tends to occur in a failed takedown. You won't learn that one in the UFC.
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Paladin - A holy beat down in the name of God!

AndrewGreen · Pre-Black Belt

Warpspider,

What style do you train?
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Andrew Green
http://innovativema.ca - All the top martial arts news!

delta1 · Black Belt

The guy paints a pretty extreme picture to make his point, but it is a good one. 'Reality' is ugly! And the ground is the last place I want to be in a street fight. But as I've said before, if it happens to go there you need to know what to do. I train both (though my grappling skills are no where near up to par yet), but the only way I want it to go to the ground is if I throw him, hard, and hopefully do some dammage.

As for the openings not taken, there's all kinds of missed shots in most fights. And on the ground, when he has the mount and is pounding your face, I guarantee you are going to miss a few shots. I think that probably detracted from his point, which is too bad. The extremists in both camps can come up with that kind of argument. I personally would look for a school that does both, then there's nothing to argue about.

Edit: one other point, the only way to really train defenses against takedowns is to spar or fight someone who is trying to do it to you. Techniques are great training aids. But the only way to make them work is to have to make them work.

Tibby · Purple Belt

aznkarateboi · Brown Belt

I think he makes some good points about the environment, though he is probably wrong when he says that if Gracie got into a fight he would get killed.

Warp Spider · Brown Belt

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